We Won!!!!!!

[parsley]

Organic growers needed to test for not only
protein, but for falling numbers, because we
mostly sell directly to mills and bakeries. And so
the combination.......protein and falling number.....
testing were routine, in the world of value adding
we aimed for, a service not required by
conventional growers or provided by the Wheat
Board.

Organics didnt ever want to be part of your world,
nor asked to. In fact we fought against the slimy
single deskers who latched onto organics, pushed
their way, like an incessant disease, begging for
government intervention, like claiming the three
pillars of the Wheat Board was their Trinity. Oh
yes, I recall it all too well. If you think you're pissy,
you oughta try me. Pars.

[rockpile]

Hopperbin, yes the Board did a sorrowful job at farmer
relations, I had confrontations myself. Yes, the CWB
should be able to sustain a solid function with the
changes now at hand, I see no reason why not.
Farmers will achieve according to their capabilities and
their sound judgement. Parsley: at the end of the day -
your organic enterprise is just another Nigerian scam -
selling fairy dust.

[oneoff]

Let it never be etched in the history stone that "organics" and "seed growers" lived under the same rules as "conventional farmers" during the reign of the CWB monopoly.
That being agreed; we would be best to forget the sorry past and concentrate on the future; which will include a new CWB direction; if the CWB provides enough tangible benefits to deserve support.

[parsley]

Rocky,
It may soothe the organic irritant that has
burrowed in your craw, if you try to view organics
as a nutritional placebo. Pretend it works!

Those ever increasing numbers of eaters who
FEEL they have constant pain from colitis and
celiac , because doctors BELIEVE wheat is
causing the epidemic, can find, at the very least,
intermittent relief in organic placebos aka organic
food.

Eat it and a celiac might FEEL better! Then, hey,
you view organic food in terms of lowering health
care costs because placebo-food mentally cures.

Also, try to think of organics as picking up your
market share that your ordinary wheat is not able
to fill; your organic neighbors will not be
competing with you, just servicing your newly
developed celiacs.

Rocky, you can rid yourself of your O-aversion, an
exciting thought indeed: just think of organics as
mind over wheat belly, so to speak, nothing
scientific, just a psychological phenomena. If the
mind is so very powerful, that a passing-thought
can cause Wd to fantasizie over Giselle, you
might also conclude that celiacs are sick because
they think they are sick. So lets call organics a
scientific tool, that cures disease caused by
thoughts, shall we, so we can cure your o-
skepticism.

I do take to heart, though, your comments about
a Nigerian scam, as I always wondered why an
institutionalized government-mandated icon such
as the Canadian Wheat Board was so legislatively
and forcefully intent upon expropriating a handful
of pissy faced organic farmers whose mandate
has been described as feeding the dying and the
pasty. With Mafia-style precision, the CWB
'wanted in' on the so-called scam, so there is
probably more to present day organics than
meets my blepharitic eyes.

In the meantime, grow your high protein wheat
that yields so much your neighbor and StatsCan
roll their eyes, and above all, enjoy your dreams,
which I don't share. Separately, we can live and
let live.....as long as you do not persist being
a yearning single desker. Pars

[jdepape]

rockpile: you’ve said a few things that prompts a reply.

Parsley is right about the lowest common denominator idea. First, trying to make every one equal like the CWB has over the years, means some winners and some losers. But with the added costs, lack of efficiencies, poor cash flow and poor marketing performance of the CWB, everyone is taken even lower – equally.

You mention protein segregations. How do you explain that the CWB pool protein spreads are about 50 cents a bu (final pool returns) when in the US they are well over 1.50 a bu. Is that a good thing? You are absolutely right – if you produce high pro wheat, under the CWB system, you are sharing your protein premiums with those that don’t grow hi pro. Segregate it all you like – you ain’t getting full value for your protein under the current system.

CWB supporters believe in a finite pie – if someone makes more, farmers will make less. I heard it from Bill Woods recently at a meeting in Winnipeg. Talking about how “those companies” that are building processing plants because of the loss of the single desk, he said “to their shareholders they are saying they will make money because they will be able to buy from farmers cheaper”. He fails to explain the other side of that – that farmers will actually get paid more too. If you don’t know how that works then perhaps you are a member of the “Brotherhood of the Shrinking Pie”.

Farmers will get paid more by local processors and yet the processors will pay less because (1) efficiencies in price discovery and risk management and (2) no CWB costs in between.

On competition – really? You and cotton don’t see competition. You’ve been paying set tariffs on wheat in the neighbourhood of $20 at the terminal and close to that at the primary elevator. No serious means of competition and no control over logistics (in and out of the elevator) means grain companies do not use price to attract business and so effectively extract a premium from the CWB (you). Without the single desk, they will compete on price – low price when they don’t want you to deliver and high price when they do. What’s the canola basis doing right now? Last I looked it was $10 OVER in Yorkton and close to that in central Alberta. If there’s no competition in that market, why would they decide to pay up like that?

Think about this. The grain business is a fixed cost business – as much as 90-95% of their costs are fixed. The actual “cost” to handle the next load of grain is very small. If they need to, they will shave their margins to bring in more grain. Why do you think they discount their CWB tariffs by as much as much as $30/tonne or more when tendering for CWB tenders?

And there is over capacity in the system and without the single desk, the effective capacity will increase – some say by as much as 20%.

So let’s see – fixed cost structure and over-capacity. Plus, new buyers are emerging. And you don’t think there will be competition? I guess you will be pleasantly surprised.

[stonepicker]

jdepape, well written, well said, well done, appreciate
it!

[parsley]

oneoff,

Decades long before organics was even
commonly recognized as a production method,
the CWB did indeed punish organics with
unreasonably priced buybacks. There was no
such thing as a 'sweet deal' in the good old days.
Initially, the CWB openly spurned organic sales
and there was zero support or sympathy for any
farmer opening up a new maket.

Once Manitoba producers began servicing the
lucrative Warburton contract, available to only the
insiders, (much like fancy Wheat Board signs
were available to encumbents but not available to
the Manitoba-kid Penner running in a Wheat
Board election) the CWB did indeed begin to,
shall we say, quietly negotiate the price of a
buyback, under the desk.

I filed away some daily CWB trucks issued to the
corporations, and avowed I would not expose
them, ....these trucks were aka buyback pricelists
that corps had to abide by....with comparative
buyback costs for the same grade on the same
day and one could see them varying wildly....a
proven way to silence any one-time brave-bastard
who asked the CWB any of the three forbidden
buyback questions---- "Why?" or "What?" or
"Who?"

Corps and organics and conventional farmers
were essentially on the CWB enemy list. Seed
growers were not.

1.Initially.....organics couldnt export. Period.
2. Then organics exported....but with ultra high
buybacks. Sometimes they were so high, the sale
stopped.
3. Then organics exported at reduced buyback
rate, as the CWB took over marketing organics.

At every opportunity. the organic industry fought
equally for organic farmers AND conventional
farmers to enjoy the same buybackrates that seed
growers have enjoyed since seed growers began.

You see, oneoff....the seed growers have never
had to do a buyback on exported seed. Period..

Learn your history, oneoff. I had to live it. And pay
for it. Pars

[oneoff]

Pars .... but you would have everyone overlook the fact that up until August of this year; even in the "good old days" it should have meant that organic farmers should not have ever had preferential treatment. I refer you to special rules for "seed growers"; "organics"; Warburton contracts; fusarium blending; high protein storage; Churchill benefits etc.
The point is that the CWB catered to some different circumstances and punished others to this day.
At least we agree to "Good riddance"; but I point out matters which historians should consider. All I know for sure is what I interpret as past personal injustices committed by the CWB that will continue to August of this year.

[bucket]

Well said oneoff!

[oneoff]

May I also reword my argument in a different way, even though this topic deserves its own thread.

Current and past CWB special treatment to the organic industry has contributed to the demise of the CWB monopoly. For that I thank the organic industry, that provides limited quantities of relatively high cost food to "fussy eaters" who have chosen to be organic food believers. If people also choose to isolate themselves in fully environmentally controlled environments (such as pig or poultry rearing facilities) there is still little probability of long term longevity or overall health benefits. It may all boil down to the analogy "that a child will never amount to much until they have ingested a teaspoonfull of dirt". And its matters little if it is organic dirt; or whatever is more convenient to obtain.
Get on with life. It only lasts so long; and those factors you have tried to control will be highly unlikely to be correlated with your cause of death.