A tale of two barleys.

[Sheepwheat]

It amazes me when I travel to see crops growing right up to tree lines in the dry areas of the prairies. Yet here where it is as wet as it gets, nothing can grow anywhere near a row of poplar trees. On a dry year such as this, there is easily 50 feet of major damage, I don't even seed within 15 feet since it will be a complete waste regardless of year. Wet years are even worse than dry on the north sides of trees.

Not sure if the difference is in the tree species, or in the soil, or in the depth plants and roots have to go to find water, maybe here they both compete for water in the first few inches, elsewhere they go much deeper?

The only exception seems to be old mature trees which have been there so long that there is a century of cow manure under them, and they aren't sending out suckers every which way, grass or crops do well in all the manure.

Then try to dry hay or swaths on north, or even east or west side of trees in our climate.

It’s as wet or wetter here than anywhere else on the prairies. So it’s gotta be something else? True trying to dry hay without wind. That’s when I see the hurt.

[Guest]

Allelopathy

[AlbertaFarmer5]

I've often suspected allelopathy is a factor. But in heavy wet ground with lots of manure and moisture, grass or crops will grow right up to a poplar tree, so the biggest factor seems to be the tree taking all the moisture and nutrients.

[Blaithin]

Seems odd that poplars in drier areas don’t cause that issue so much. Less water to go around than there. I wonder if it’s more that it’s too wet for them, more so on the north. They don’t get the sun to help balance out the moisture and just do poorly. Shaded, cool and wet all year.

Would young trees take more water as they’re growing or less because they’re not as big? Growing should be sucking more nutrients for those fast trees I’d imagine.

Either the mature trees use less water, which helps the crop grow, or take more and therefore help them not drown. Also heavy manured and deep soil will be able to hold more water without becoming saturated.

Could also just be your average rooting issue. Crops don’t root deep because there’s lots of water, then the trees start to draw in summer and the plants have hobbled themselves.

Might be a neat place to experiment when and if you get the time and inclination (haha). Even playing around with a buffer in that 15’ you don’t use. Put in a strip of wildflowers or something that’s more adept at a treed environment. Could tell you if it’s the trees being mean or the crop being wimpy.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

Could also just be your average rooting issue. Crops don’t root deep because there’s lots of water, then the trees start to draw in summer and the plants have hobbled themselves.

Might be a neat place to experiment when and if you get the time and inclination (haha). Even playing around with a buffer in that 15’ you don’t use. Put in a strip of wildflowers or something that’s more adept at a treed environment. Could tell you if it’s the trees being mean or the crop being wimpy.

I think your exactly right about the average rooting depth. Here where both plants and trees are spoiled by adequate moisture they have very shallow roots, so both are competing for the same water and nutrients. And the trees here grow much much larger faster and sucker much more aggressively than drier areas. 2 ft plus diameter poplar trees are very common. Suckers grow 6 ft plus high within a year.

As for the experiment, I have been experimenting with the d8. Push the trees into a pile and burn them then spread all that beautiful topsoil further and wider. So far the results have been 100% successful. Easily add a zero to the crop yield in the areas that were adjacent to the trees.

[Blaithin]

You don’t like flowers? 😂

[Sheepwheat]

I dunno. I don’t get it I guess? Lol

[AlbertaFarmer5]

You don’t like flowers? 😂

I really like flowers, especially the yellow ones I plant where the trees used to be.

[Blaithin]

I really like flowers, especially the yellow ones I plant where the trees used to be.

They say strips of wildflowers help increase pollination of those yellow ones. 😜

[Blaithin]

Seen a barley field opened up down south. Getting 15bpa.... Yuck.