Saskatoon seed royalty meeting

[vvalk]

Vvalk, could you perhaps explain in more detail how variety development would help profitability? Are you hoping the EPR would somehow help in creating a superwheat or have characteristics that no other country could duplicate? If other countries come up with the greatest germplasm, lets just buy it.

Once disease resistance, or yield gains are discovered, all the countries immediately follow suit and we are right back to where we are today - minus a large EPR deduction. Wouldn't it maybe be better if the world produced less wheat and there was market pull for our product, not always market push?

Profitable crops are that way because of market demand, not germplasm research. Wheat will never be bio engineered, so the realizable gains are tiny at best.

Staying ahead of the demand for wheat is not how you make money. So, curious how any of this will benefit the farmer?

In regards to EPR and GRDC, name one major advancement in wheat after the billions spent?

How many Australian farmers would go back to their old systems since EPR were introduced. How many Australian varieties are grown in western Canada? Why are new varieties always about yield? One component for sure and maybe the biggest? What about disease resistance example fusarium , drought tolerant, lower inputs needed, much shorter straw. Sawfly resistant Salt tolerant etc etc. One thing I would agree is that older varieties shouldn’t be deregistered to force farmers into upov 91 varieties and newer. Again that’s a CGC issue and pretty sure the wgwga again is and has been in front of the CGC change discussions.

[sumdumguy]

The seed companies can just do whatever makes them a buck as long as we aren’t paying for them to play. How much do they need? The pedigreed seed system worked for years, government chipped in from time to time. Now that’s not enough, they want producers to be on the hook( over and over) for all their “experiments”. Correct me if I am wrong Vvalk.

[vvalk]

Geez ...thats as harsh as my "you dumb ****" comment ....be careful farmaholic.. you will be labelled a jealous coffee shop farmer by those elite 4th generation farmers that had daddy doing the work while they pranced around smelling politicians farts....lol...

I’ll assume Bucket that was meant for me. Yes I’m fourth generation but my family doesn’t have succession issues. My great grandfather and grandfather all left farming in their fifties. My dad quit working on the farm besides helping here and there when I came back from university when I was 22 years old. I have been runnning the farm in its entirety since then have have tripled in size. All while working for almost 10 years in Ottawa helping to get rid of the CWB amongst other things. I actually get involved instead of being a know it all who sits behind a key board criticizing everything and everyone.

[AlbertaFarmer5]

What you are referring to is Genetic Use Restriction Technology (GURTS). It would solve so many problems like volunteers, adventitious presence issues, no TUA's etc but it died in '05 as just one more way that Monsanto was going to control the worlds food population and the successful consumer fear campaign of the organic industry to keep ag locked into 1967.

Thanks for the explanation and link. I remember hearing a lot about it, but then it fell off the radar, and I didn't know what the status was, or if it just wasn't viable.

Don't you have that backwards, wouldn't the organic industry prefer that conventional ag adopt as many scary sounding technologies as possible, in order to use fear marketing to sell their own product?

[Guest]

How many Australian farmers would go back to their old systems since EPR were introduced. How many Australian varieties are grown in western Canada? Why are new varieties always about yield? One component for sure and maybe the biggest? What about disease resistance example fusarium , drought tolerant, lower inputs needed, much shorter straw. Sawfly resistant Salt tolerant etc etc. One thing I would agree is that older varieties shouldn’t be deregistered to force farmers into upov 91 varieties and newer. Again that’s a CGC issue and pretty sure the wgwga again is and has been in front of the CGC change discussions.

the question you would need to ask is ; how many Aussie varieties are grown in Russia, China ,etc. ?
we can't even grow unity wheat for hrsw , let alone an Aussie variety , strange statement you made ?
lower inputs ? we're about 60% higher than 20 years ago ?? and yield is up about 5-10% on hrsw ? not following this logic?
some brand new varities are terrible for fuz, that we paid $17 / bu for seed , and yields less than unity

[dmlfarmer]

What about disease resistance example fusarium , drought tolerant, lower inputs needed, much shorter straw. Sawfly resistant Salt tolerant etc etc.

I find it interesting that GMO technology was promised to bring these same benefits to growers but in reality the only benefit out of GMO to the grain grower was herbicide tolerance. And interestingly it was only the herbicides which the developers of the technology were already selling. Yes, society did get non browning apples, but there was no product on the market which the trait would replace. And it does offer golden rice which the market refuses to accept. But how about the seed industry develop these magnificent traits first, and then farmers will flock to buy them at your price (see canola) instead of more empty promises that may or may not come to pass.

Oh and by the way, please provide the answers to the questions you asked as I am sure you must know. Just don't forget to detail where the answers you provide came from and how they were verified. Because I am sure you must have well documented facts from credited polling firms of large numbers of Australian farmers, (and that it is just not your bias and opinion), that is the basic for the insinuation your questions leads readers to think that all Australian farmers prefer having to pay royalties over the old system./

[Tucker]

they have it already , it's called the terminator gene

From what I remember reading a white paper on the terminator technology years ago the seed would replicate as normal for seed growers but when sold to farmers for commercial production it would be coated with an antibiotic. I think it was penicillin that would activate the terminator gene upon germination and render the resulting seed production sterile. Each seed coated in the stuff. Sounds like a horrible recipe for antibiotic resistance gone wild. Thankfully that was never implemented, never ever wish it back.

[wd9]

Thanks for the explanation and link. I remember hearing a lot about it, but then it fell off the radar, and I didn't know what the status was, or if it just wasn't viable.

Don't you have that backwards, wouldn't the organic industry prefer that conventional ag adopt as many scary sounding technologies as possible, in order to use fear marketing to sell their own product?

The most puzzling thing ever, and you would think its backwards. It kind of started in very late 90's early 2000 when the organic industry sued Monsanto for adventitious presence in organic canola, I was on CCGA at the time. Well they lost and at that time decided to move towards the court of public opinion by differentiating their product as safe and GMO as unsafe. Once they headed down that path, they couldn't stop. But it does have benefits as the harder it is for conventional ag to produce product - losing chemistry like glyphosate etc, preventing the approval of novel traits etc, the less volume they have to compete with. But farmers produce too much anyways, so that didn't pan out either.

The irony is organic, as well as conventional, could both benefit greatly from bio engineering. But we won't see anything happen for years. They ruined any sort of real progress even though good ideas could come up for them as well.

[vvalk]

I find it interesting that GMO technology was promised to bring these same benefits to growers but in reality the only benefit out of GMO to the grain grower was herbicide tolerance. And interestingly it was only the herbicides which the developers of the technology were already selling. Yes, society did get non browning apples, but there was no product on the market which the trait would replace. And it does offer golden rice which the market refuses to accept. But how about the seed industry develop these magnificent traits first, and then farmers will flock to buy them at your price (see canola) instead of more empty promises that may or may not come to pass.

Oh and by the way, please give the answers to the questions you asked as I am sure you must know. Just don't forget to provide where the answers you provide came from and how they were verified. Because I am sure you must have well documented facts from credited polling firms of large numbers of Australian farmers that will tell us the number Australian farmers who prefer having to pay royalties over the old system./

Aussie farmers have been on these forums and I don’t remember any saying they hate EPR. Could be wrong for sure. You make my point that every country is different and varieties in general won’t work else where. THe whole point to say an EPR is the seed company doesn’t get paid unless the farmer buys it. If there isn’t a return on the cost then the farmer won’t buy it no one is forcing you to buy whatever seed you mention for $17. As for lower costs I’m talking about new varieties that may not need fungicide or as much fertilizer or whatever. I don’t have a crystal ball. The whole point is to get investment. As for GMO they have varieties on the shelf that would eliminate the fusarium issue

[northfarmer]

I’ll assume Bucket that was meant for me. Yes I’m fourth generation but my family doesn’t have succession issues. My great grandfather and grandfather all left farming in their fifties. My dad quit working on the farm besides helping here and there when I came back from university when I was 22 years old. I have been runnning the farm in its entirety since then have have tripled in size. All while working for almost 10 years in Ottawa helping to get rid of the CWB amongst other things. I actually get involved instead of being a know it all who sits behind a key board criticizing everything and everyone.

kudos to you Vvalk for your efforts on behalf of farmers, I have also sacrificed valuable time away from my family and my farm to engage in the politics of our industry, those that have not should give it a go and gain some perspective on our industry instead of the echo chamber they live in

jealousy is a wasted emotion, not sure why I drift back to this forum from time to time as the debate and exchanges have only degenerated more over time

I have deleted more replies and posts than i have submitted as a result and that is a shame as platforms such as this could be such a good place for thoughtful and constructive debate of issues of the day affecting farming.