Provinces complaining about equalization

[furrowtickler]

Maybe a bit off topic but...just be glad you wont be around to see what will be going on in canada and the USA in 50 to 75 years or so. Immigrants will be fighting for control along with natives and special interest groups. There will eventually be a war over all of this. North America has not seen European style conflict on it's own soil but it will eventually. Different groups come in and want to set all the ground rules to form their own new country. Laugh all you want.....you wont be laughing last that's a guarantee.

As we watch Western Europe falter .... we will be only 5-10 years behind that train wreck of far left socialism disaster. So here it will be within 15 years ... not 50
Engrained Religious and social beliefs are just way to far apart .

[burnt]

CBC ? = Fake News

https://nationalpost.com/feature/northern-ontarios-dream-to-secede-reborn-were-treated-like-a-colony

Welp, does this map suit you better?

Dang, it looks a lot like the other one.

https://nationalpostcom.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/940.jpg?quality=60&strip=all https://nationalpostcom.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/940.jpg?quality=60&strip=all

Or this one?

http://www.elections.ca/res/cir/maps2/map.asp?map=ERMap_42&lang=e http://www.elections.ca/res/cir/maps2/map.asp?map=ERMap_42&lang=e

Oops, more of the same.

I am not denying that there is an element of secessionists.

What shows though, as the NP article says, is that the north tends to vote for the winner.

What I would see as a solution that would solve a broad range of problems is that Toronto/GTA forms its own province.
It's just wrong that such a small, disenfranchised area has such a huge amount of power over an area - the ROC - from which it is completely alienated.

[seldomseen]

Oh and one more thing....

Western separation is nothing but something to talk about. Never going to happen. They would let us vote but if it ever was put into motion the federal government would have the military in here in a flash. No west, no country. The separatist leaders would be having tragic "accidents" left right and center.

That's why Statehood makes sense. If Trudeau gets re elected Canadas army will be nothing more than Care Bears riding on Barney the dragon!

[Oliver88]

More Quebec hypocrisy:

"In 2017, 60% of the nearly 500,000 new vehicles sold in Quebec were in the category that includes light trucks and SUVs. And Quebec brings in a ton of oil from foreign markets."
Source: Edmonton Sun

[furrowtickler]

More Quebec hypocrisy:

"In 2017, 60% of the nearly 500,000 new vehicles sold in Quebec were in the category that includes light trucks and SUVs. And Quebec brings in a ton of oil from foreign markets."
Source: Edmonton Sun

Hmmmm , have not province ... tough times over there eh ?

[6V53]

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[farmaholic]

Sask "had" been on the receiving end of Equalization payments as well but things were pretty ****en grim here in a province of less than a million people. Now how can a low population province be expected to shore up the standard of living for one of the largest provinces of the country. And at the same time have them stand in the way of our resource development by not buying our oil or allowing it to get to an export position. The very thing that makes their equalization payments possible.

If they don't like it's quality, refine it here and send it to them in a pipe(dream).


Hard to believe...

[Horse]

Interesting program on radio today, the reason Québec gets transfer payments is because they have low wages therefore can't tax the population, where as alta has high wages,, mostly due to the oil patch and there high wages,, kind of ironic isn't it oil the root of all our problems and the solution.

[farmaholic]

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Yikes, and I thought I could swear. If that dude is from Alta does anyone know if he is Tom4's kid?

[chuckChuck]

Alberta’s fury is aimed at Quebec (again)
Gary Mason
Gary Mason National affairs columnist

Updated December 11, 2018

The howls of outrage were as certain, and predictable, as winter snow on the prairies.

It happens each time the federal government reveals how much funding have-not provinces such as Quebec will receive under the national equalization program – Alberta goes ballistic. And with oil-price angst running at new highs and a provincial election around the corner, the fury emanating from Wild Rose country has been a sight to behold.

Perhaps no one has embodied the righteous indignation that is almost defining Alberta at the moment more than Jason Kenney, Leader of the United Conservative Party and the best bet to become premier after next spring’s election.

Yes, the fun may only be beginning.

The federal Finance Ministry recently revealed details of next year’s transfer levels, and they showed, among other things, that Quebec will receive $13.1-billion – which represents a $1.4-billion increase from the previous year and two-thirds of the total amount in the equalization pot.

This has become an increasingly bitter pill for people in Alberta to swallow for two reasons: the oil industry is in the tank right now and Quebec is against the Energy East pipeline going ahead. Quebec Premier François Legault inflamed the situation by saying last week he’s not “ashamed at all of refusing dirty energy.”

A needless and thoughtless provocation under the present circumstances, to be sure.

This, of course, set Mr. Kenney off. He rarely needs an excuse to go after Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and this was fodder too rich and tasty to pass up. So to Twitter he took: “PM Trudeau gave Quebec a veto over any future Energy East Pipeline. Premier Legault exercised that veto, saying oil is ‘not socially acceptable in Quebec.’ Now QC gets $1.4 billion more in equalization for a total of $13 billion, thanks in part to Alberta’s oil industry.”

“Albertans are generous,” he said in another tweet. “But we shouldn’t be taken for suckers.”

Mr. Kenney would have known, likely as he tweeted those words, that is not true. Perhaps in a post-truth world, that doesn’t matter. The federal government didn’t give Quebec a veto over Energy East. The reason the project died was because Ottawa brought in new, tougher environmental regulations the proponent didn’t like so it walked away.

You can blame it on Quebec if you want, or you can acknowledge the federal government has a moral obligation to start reducing carbon emissions in this country. If that comes at the expense of a pipeline project so be it, I guess, unless Mr. Kenney can think of a way to get around the small problem of climate change. But to suggest Mr. Legault “exercised that veto” is a blatant falsehood. Mr. Legault wasn’t even premier when the project was deep-sixed.

As for equalization, I’m sure it’s tough for a lot of people in Alberta to see money going to a province that is projecting a $3-billion surplus. It’s also a province with outrageously high taxes, a burden Albertans don’t have. The equalization payouts are based on a formula that was conceived by the former federal Conservative cabinet, of which Mr. Kenney was a member. So he’s angry about a disbursement blueprint that he approved.

The equalization fund is made up primarily of money the federal government collects in taxes. Yes, Albertans contribute a disproportionate share, not because they’re getting ripped off, but because there are, per capita, more wealthy people in the province. The more you make the more you pay in income taxes, the more GST you pay because of your purchasing power.

I’ve never understood why politicians in Alberta think those in the rest of the country should be down on their hands and knees in gratitude because people in that province make so much.

I understand there are many living there now who are genuinely suffering as a result of the downturn in oil prices. There are people under economic stress in every province. (Visit Newfoundland and Labrador.) But trying to exploit that grief for political gain is wrong.

As we’ve seen in Donald Trump’s America, there is a huge social cost to dividing a country with words, by pitting one group of people against another. Are there problems with Canada’s equalization program? There may well be, ones the previous federal government contributed to in devising the formula.

But for heaven’s sake, let’s have a civilized and rational discussion about it rather than stoke anger and resentment. Or, in this day and age, is that too much to ask?

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-albertas-fury-is-aimed-at-quebec-again/

[SASKFARMER3]

Chuck do you even know anything about the American people or the country.

Liberals have lost their mind and are ending real fast.

The border shit is shit and it is driving Democrats who originated from Mexico to the Republican party.

It's not white and black.

americans are working and happy.

Americans are making money on stocks and happy.

Americans are building and travelling and enjoying their time.



Canadians are Shitting the bed.

Keep believing Trudeau is the answer.

Canada the Mexico of the north.

[chuckChuck]

SF3. I am not sure how vacationing in Florida each winter gives you any special insights into the lives and circumstances of many Americans? Its a big and diverse country with lots of low income families. Many of which cant afford health care or health insurance.

[SASKFARMER3]

Chuck half my family is American. So yea I kind of got an idea what's going on.

They are everything from Truck drivers to school teachers to Computer science majors, to electricians etc.

But keep preaching as I just love the solar panels at your acreage.

Natural sun in Florida yea it works there but ugly as sin.

[jazz]

The difference in Ab and Que isn't about personal income levels, its more about socialism vs capitalism. Ab prefers to pay a higher wage and let people direct their spending. That extra income is taxed and redistributed. Que chooses to fund expensive social programs and have people make less. So Ab has a annual income $20k higher than Que but Que had funded daycare and all other goodies.

Maybe clawing back equalization is as easy as just having more govt funded social programs in Ab. The govt is a poor steward of our money but its better than dumping it all in another province who hates us. The feds have no problem clawing it out of oil workers hands but if that money was being spent on day care and other socialized services they would be loathe to take it.

[sumdumguy]

SF3. I am not sure how vacationing in Florida each winter gives you any special insights into the lives and circumstances of many Americans? Its a big and diverse country with lots of low income families. Many of which cant afford health care or health insurance.

You should go and see for yourself. I know you have this pre-conceived notion that health care is outrageous in US, but we have tried their system and both dental and medical treatments that we bought were way cheaper than here. Canadians are being fleeced and they think they are privileged.

As for happy people, we’ve travelled and stayed for long periods in US, noticed hundreds of thousands of Canadians love being there and are welcomed with open arms all across US. Socialist dingbats won’t allow themselves the opportunity of finding out first-hand. Better still, stay the “f” at home, we don’t need a bad reputation down there.