Shake my head

[iceman]

Farmaholic,

To my knowledge Agristability works off accrual income. They also set the prices of the inventory. Ie if you sell into a premium market it doesn't make a difference to your reference margin. #1 canola is #1 canola price set by them.

Tax is tax and it all gets paid whether you live to pay it or not. Maybe they would capture more tax on record years. A farmer could also just underestimate the value of his inventory at year end which would have the same outcome as deferring a portion of his crop.

Maybe I'm wrong on this & if I am it would be the first time ever
Iceman Out

Also let's not fool are selves agriInvest will be scrapped. Way to much money sitting idle in those accounts national for them to keep adding.

[farmaholic]

Accrual based tax filing sounds like reconciling nightmare. Inventory adjustmemts. What's the value of the inventory at the fiscal year end? What was the actual cash value of the sales of that inventory when they were made. Canary seed and yellow mustard squirrelled away for cyclical market peaks. Losses due to spoilage. Grade changes. Pre-buys because of early bargains out of the calculations. Maybe they should also tax the difference in value, or increase in value, of year end prebuy fertilizer versus spring(in-season gouging)buy fert. Accounts payable...accounts receivable. Ad nauseum.....

[vvalk]

Let me know if I'm wrong here or if this has been talked about and I missed it but I posted a thread on "federal budget". In that thread I posted a paragraph out of the federal budget. Here it is again: "The income tax rules provide a deferral in respect of deferred cash purchase tickets issued for deliveries of certain listed grains. Given changes in the grain marketing regime in Canada, the Government is conducting a public consultation regarding the ongoing utility of this income tax deferral."
There was 3 comments on it I think. I start to wonder how many actual farmers are on this site when something like this which would fundamentally change how we run our farms is completely ignored for trival thread topics Though charging pst on crop and hail insurance is brutal

Here is some more detail out of that budget. Quote
"
CONSULTATION ON CASH
PURCHASE TICKETS
When a farmer delivers a listed grain (i.e., wheat, oats, barley, rye, flaxseed,
****seed or canola) to the operator of a licensed elevator, the operator may
issue to the farmer a cash purchase ticket or other prescribed form of settlement. If
the cash pur
chase ticket (or other prescribed form of settlement) in respect of a
delivery of a listed grain is payable in the year following the year in which the grain
is delivered (a “deferred cash purchase ticket”), the taxpayer includes the amount
of the ticket i
n income in that following year. The treatment of deferred cash
purchase tickets that are issued in respect of deliveries of listed grains is a
departure from the general rule with respect to taxpayers (including other farmers)
who are required to include the amount of a security or other evidence of
indebtedness received as payment of a currently
-payable debt in income in the
year in which it is received.
The historical rationale for the tax deferral for cash purchase tickets in respect of
listed grains relates to international grain shipment agreements and the Canadian
Wheat Board’s former position as the sole purchaser of listed grain in Manitoba,
Saskatchewan and Alberta. With the deregulation of the grain marketing regime
and commercialization of the Canadian Wheat Board, the delivery of the listed
grains is now the responsibility of private business rather than the federal
government. As a result, there is arguably no longer a clear policy rationale for
maintaining the tax deferral accorded to deferred
cash purchase tickets received
as payment for listed grains.
Budget 2017 launches a consultation on the income tax deferral available in
respect of deferred cash purchase tickets for deliveries of listed grains.
Stakeholders are invited to provide comments on the ongoing utility, and potential
elimination, of this tax deferral, including any app
ropriate transitional period
or rules.
The Government invites interested parties to submit comments by
May 24, 2017.
Please send your comments to
consultation_tax_"

[vvalk]

Can't figure out what the CWB has to do with any of this. Shows to me they are going ahead with this no matter what the consultations say, they figure they have their scape goat

[mcfarms]

So what's next big tax fines for misreporting inventory levels to stats can? Or jail time for refusing to report ?
Vvalk what's the ability in the us of farmers to defer.? Has been a valuable tool for long term stability on farms if we are fored to give it up the 500000 amount needs to be moved at least to 750000 maybe higher with a inflationary rider on it .pretty tough anymore to try and pay minimum tax which they are trying to get us above on good years and buy anything in the way of land and machinery. Have got thoughts on how this may be dealt with to some portion but won't share as I am unsure without a discussion with my accountants.

[Braveheart]

I'm guessing the reason for mentioning the CWB is that some farmers, that could afford to, would deliver wheat to the Board, but defer the sale if they thought next year's pool would provide higher returns. I knew a few durum growers that did well using this approach.

Regardless, this move by the gov't could prove costly for farmers that had started down the deferral road years ago. Once started, it became the norm.

Cattle producers haven't been able to do it for years now.

[farmaholic]

Wasn't the problem with the deferred cattle cheque because it was the auction mart issuing the cheque and not the actual "Buyer". When we still had cattle we had so sign some sort of declaration (or something) when we wanted our cheque deferred.

[Braveheart]

Farmaholic, I believe you're right on the cattle. There may also have been issues with surety of payment of deferred cattle cheques.

[farmaholic]

vvalk....the reasons I posted to leave things as is are sound rational ideas. People expect us to operate and manage our business when our business is almost like no other! Powerless, price takers, weather dependant, can't even support staffing requirements of usual business structure. ...management structure and we're expected to do as much of everything else as possible because there isn't enough money to pay someone else for everything that needs to get(or be) done(Jack of all trades master of his own {farmer} mentality).

[SASKFARMER3]

Its almost time to pack up the Truck and move to Beverly hills. What a useless country canada is becoming. I would rather bet on Trump and USA over the shit that goes down here.

Every day i wonder how much longer farmers can make a go of it in Canada. Every day we get creamed. Prov budget took a few more dollars a acre just like that.

Sick