Are ratepayers meant to have no input into their rural municipal governance

[jackspratwhynot]

Believe me when I report that at least some municipal councils have acted in a secret fashion where at least some important council decisions are deliberately hidden from the general public.
One of the tenants of democracy is that rural municipal business is done in an open public forum (monthly council meetings) ; and represents the needs and aspirations of the ratepayers that the council members represent. Is it then accepable for a council to decide to all but swear themselves to secrecy; and amongst only council members decide to not publicize a potentially important decision in any way; and even make those council decision at a chosen moment when no member of the general public had any chance of observing that decision at the "open" council meeting. It is then buried in the minutes and deleted from the public press release of business conducted.
You may as well know, dear reader that the RM of Enniskillen has chosen the winner of a lottery for perhaps what will be seen as one of the most prime properties in western Canada. There was one ticket available and once some "unknown" non-Canadian company picked it up; it was a council decision that no other competing bids would be allowed. The "facility"; or as I believe "facilities" are not being discussed. A "company" is a also acquiring "all" the substancial public RM property in the hamlet of Northgate; without advertisement; or consultation with the Econonomic Development officer; the ratepayers or any other municipalities or towns; but with the full cooperation of our "elected" representatives.


This mode of council action may be more commonplace than imagined. A couple of years ago; in the adjoining RM of Moose Creek; a couple million dollar obligation to build a provincial highway was reported to the ratepayers in a way that even the most observant person had no idea that the arguably largest ever RM project was underway.
It should be of interest that in that case the RM of Moose Creek lawyers strongly argued to the Court of Queen's Bench judge; that all ratepayers had been adequately informed (though the right to access council minutes).

In the next breath; a substantial amount of taxpayers money is being spent on an "essential" economic development plan. The input is to come from the ratepayers (lol, lol, lol) An "all about the money" decision might as well be that we dispense with the charades; and council simply chose the best "benevalent dictator" that money can acquire.
Pragmatic messengers for democratic principles would also have to agree that in the real world this might as well happen.
After last night's council meeting I did fully stick my neck out before the reeve and almost full council. I give them full credit (as individuals) for hearing me out; and feel that I had the full attention of at least a strong majority present. I think I presented a perspective that had not been seriusly considered before; but am not naive enough to believe that any future council decision will be conducted in any significantly different manner than has been done in the past.
I leave it up to those who never will have any clue or interest about imminent municipal changes to building codes; inspectors; zoning; drainage, bylaw enforcement; policing; fencing; roads and approaches; community planning. Most will remain oblivious to what happened last night, in the past, or will happen in the future.

But rest assured that someone's viewpoint expressed in a letter to the editor about a new housing project's shortcomings will be used to attack the author; and not one of the points raised will beconsidered on its merits.

[bucket]

I think it happens everywhere. When you point it out, you are bullied into being quiet by those that don't want to be publicly embarrassed by their lack of ethics.

[Burbert]

Its the new way of doin business in
Comedia. Look at the current Fed
gobermont leading Comedia down a garden
path. Comedia is open fer business. Page
torn from the Klein daze in Albertie!!
Lucky us, we get ta lay back and get it
weather we likes it er not....

[jackspratwhynot]

Here's another actual example of how the municipal councils (owners of Borderline Housing Carnduff) conduct ratepayers business (the owners being my rural municipalities, and other adjoining municipalities, and a few villages and towns in SE Sask.
It is now several years since an addition of 10 senior housing units and attached doctor/dental facilities was let for approx $1.7 million US. Its fair to say that the situation turned "ugly, ugly, ugly" due a combination of circumstances, (all reporting and public discussion kept as low key as humanly possible). It took at least 8 attempts at additional money injections, credit union financing agreements and increases in levies upon municipal bodies; but the project has finally been basically completed (literally years later); but certainly not for the original amount expected.

Neither is the story over; whatever the story was and is ; (in fact not even once superficially reported to the public in any way, shape or form). The one person who has identified deficiencies in construction is now being attacked for expressing their concerns.
The disagreements between the professional engineer, the original US contractor; the municipalities etc. has already been apparently referred to "mediation" to no doubt try to settle claims before it becomes a court matter. There has been a "mediation" report (I assume documenting the "mediation" attempt results just recently provided by Borderline Housing to the municipalities; along with instructions that no one else's eyes may see the report. I have asked the reeve of my municipality (in presence of several councillors) to provide public access to this report. I am promised a decision, and will not be satisfied with stonewalling from a Borderline Housing Board that has shown a reluctance in publishing any of the facts that led to the admitted present utter financial disaster. Want to bet that no one will get to see the report ? Or that a few more people will grow some balls in one form or another or show some courage and speak up.
Another tidbit reported to a recent RM Council meeting is that the auditor did not give a "clean bill of health" to Borderline last year. What should that tell everyone?.
Suffice it to say that money was thrown at completion attempts until finally something got basically completed at ratepayers expense.
Is this a case study that anyone is proud of? Do the ratepayers have any right to accountability and disclosure? What was learned; and will those responsible be the same Borderline Housing directors/council members that be the same persons commandeer the next municipal multimillion dollar project.
Should the messengers somehow be silenced?

[jackspratwhynot]

Attn Update

Because mediation is still in progress; "Borderline Housing" is refusing to give the public access to the report at this time. That is the current decision just given to myself.

BUT does that mean when "mediation" has been concluded or maybe even abandoned because the US contractor (Sawtooth Construction) possibly never intended on showing up; or had any intention of risking setting foot on soil in another country, or parties couldn't agree on who owed whom; or whatever; then would anyone expect the board of directors to come clean about all the details? Or will silence continue and stonewalling still be the order of the day?

[ColevilleH2S]

If these councils are so blatantly incompetent, or corrupt, or whatever, why do they keep getting re-elected?

I think this quote fits,"Citizens get the government they deserve".

[jackspratwhynot]

That is an excellent question; and you have correctly also provided the answer "We get the governments that we deserve"

It should be noted that council members usually assume office by acclamation. Another fact is that even if they were drunk or stoned out of their minds there are very few people who would consider running local public office.(most often from the very persons who are most desperately needed) The weak excuses of too busy; too old; not interested; thankless job etc. can be countered by some form of amalgamation so that it will be important job; adequate compensation; enough distance from purely family relations and pressure and expectations from those you wish to remain your friends under all circumstances.
In most cases incumbants and replacement council members do not understand code of ethics, codes of conduct, the Municipal Act, exclusion from conflicts of interest and many are not willing to listen or learn.

On the other hand; ratepayes do not show enough support to those who are doing their best; show lack of interest; don't want to keep up to date on issues; are not willing to confront their friends and neighbors entrusted with public positions.
On all sides it involves defects in human characterics involving knowledge; honesty; fair play; courage; tolerance and respect etc. The one remedy that would be most effective and immediate would be a mandated 50% female gender on rural municipal councils. It is my opinion that an immediate attitude change would automatically happen.

[dustyroad]

I do not follow municipal politics nor am i on the RM council but i do know a bit about what is going on in and around northgate and the companies involved. Let me say this, if your statements about your rural government is as outrageous and misleading as the information you have provided about companies,people and business dealings regarding northgate and area then you as an individual have no credibility, and why should i believe anything you say about your rural government. P.S the lots the RM sold at northgate have been for sale forever just like in any other town or rm. This was not a "single lottery ticket" - you,i and any other individual could have bought them. It just took this for us to realize how important and valuable this and surrounding land will be in the near future. One year ago no one had heard of Northgate. This could change fast.
GET OVER IT. I feel you are jeopardizing the credibility of this forum and the people who have valid topics to discuss with what I see as a person with nothing to do but dream up new conspiracy theories about your local government.

[jackspratwhynot]

Dustyroad is not the first person who claims to know what is going on at Northgate. (Cottonpicken and at least one RM councillor have previously bragged in the same way).
But none of those people had any intention of telling the public what they know. There are insiders who are making the decisions (regarding public property) and now attempting to destroy the credibility of anyone who asks for the facts from those insiders. This is another example of "I can't /won't tell you"

How many complete hamlet or village sites have been sold to one person (you, I or anyone else). And as an insider; if you are on council; my suspicion is that you have agreed to not breathe a word to the public until all the property that this non-Canadian entity wants has been acquired. And if it turns out that Northgate was prime real estate; just how has the RM protected and ensured its development for the maximum benefit of this area. I suspect that all "lottery tickets" were "sold" to one foreign holding company; and know that neither I nor even you were meant to have any chance of having any piece of the action. But there always will be at least the perception that those who new the facts (and didn't publically disclose them) could have personally profited if they had been smart enough and didn't know what a potential conflict of interest was.

And just to show you that you and the others who are deciding future development at Northgate are capable of making the same blunders that happened with Borderlin Housing Carnduff; maybe you can tell us how all how the surveyed streets and lanes of Northgate are going to to be handed over. Has our Majesty the Queen been consulted yet; because she is the one who needs to sign off.
Dustyroad..... Just tell us all your relationship to council. eg. wife, close neighbor, lapdog or whatever

[jackspratwhynot]

Dusty.... As for having nothing else to do; I would suggest that at the present time I have decided that writing this note is the most important thing I have to do. I have a hundred other tasks that would certainly benefit myself to a much greater extent. And I will get to a few of them later. As persons who actually know me if you don't yet know my accomlishments.
If you want to match wits with me then bring it on. If you want to compare your accomplishments and failures with me; then start writing. If you have opinions I'll respond. I stand on my reputation; opinions, suspicisions and facts I know and can confirm.
You provide me with your facts so that I may check them out.

[jackspratwhynot]

Also please don't worry about the credibilty of any internet posting forum. It is only one of a million sounding boards where information can not be relied on any more than gossip at a coffeeshop or any watering hole. C'mon give us a break on that argument.

[cottonpicken]

Stop thinking you have a clue about what i do or don't
know.

It does not take a fkin genius to figure out there is an
ocean of oil underneath the area and that to get the
stuff out and to market is going to need a god damn
railroad and the industry is snowballing at such a rate
every piece of infrastructure needs to be utilized in
the area.

The fact you didn't see the reality of the situation
doesn't make everyone else the bad guy.

And i also don't really have a clue about what exactly
your allegations are,could you put them in simple
point form sentences(trust me you will get more
replies in all topics if you learn to use as few as words
as possible instead of long drawn out paragraphs)

[gregpet]

How do claim to be credible while remaining anonymous? Grow
some stones if you want credibility and put your name to it.

[jackspratwhynot]

cottonpicken posted Jan 17, 2012 12:58
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I actually know the answer to quite a few of those
questions,i thought the answers where common
knowlege,maybe i was told in confidence,i'll get
back to to you

[cottonpicken]

I remember the thread.

You then continuously insulted me,and then wonder
why i don't tell you what i know.