Cost of Living

[crossfield_beef]

To further some previous topics I was wondering if you people know what it costs you to "live".
How many dollars of cash would it take to provide the kind of living you are providing for your family.
This includes home power, car transportation, home heating, entertainment, clothes etc, groceries etc.
Do you or spouse smoke. That is expensive these days.
The question is how many dollars does your farm have to generate to provide a living for your family.
In my case it takes $4000 per month CASH to do these things and we are living pretty slim. I have four children. I know that if I do not bring in $4000 cash each month from somewhere that I am going to have to draw off equity.
Considering that the average in town worker works 44 hours per week how many dollars per hour would you have to make to earn a living?

[lakenheath]

There are many people that are getting by on less than that. I don't know if you are factoring in mortgage payments or not but any interest, vehicle payments, other debt adds to the bottom line.

People can exist and live on less than $4000 per month, in fact many of them do.

I would doubt that the average wage earner working in stores such as Home Depot, WalMart, etc are bringing home that amount.

Entertainment and sports activities for kids certainly make up a large amount of monthly expenditures when costs of enrolling in sports, equipment etc. are factored in.

Operating a vehicle costs a lot and driving kids to various activities certainly adds to the cost of living.

[crossfield_beef]

FYI
I can calculate the cost of travel gas separate from my farm fuel. It always costs at least $400 per month to drive to work and some months twice that amount. We have a large older home in town that costs 450 per month to heat in a warm winter.
The heating costs and electrical costs are higher than normal because of our older home. Gas for travel to work is normal for most people travelling to work these days.
Yes I do have a separate mortgage for my home and home property. This adds to cost.
However building a home on my farm was going to be a total loss as the extra expense of the home was not going to add an equal amount to the value of the farm. If I ever have to sell my farm to the Hutterites, I know that they do not want a farm home.
This way my wife has Dower rights to the home and lot in town, but not on our farm. As well the idea was that my wife would go to work when the kids started school and from our farm location that would have been more difficult. Now my wife is starting to work and that helps.
My wife smokes, which costs a fortune.
Figure $500 per month.
Other than that we have health care, some small dental bills, high speed internet and I have a family pass to Calaway park.
Some of these things we could do without, but mainly my living cost seems high because I have separated farm costs and living costs totally.
My wife was trying to tell me that the reason the farm was not doing well was that farming is a poor business. I am trying to prove that farming is OK but the cost of living is what is destroying our farms. Wives these days look at the families where the husband works in the oil patch and has a new company pickup that can pull a holiday trailer. The oil people can go to Vegas and Mexico in the winter and the wives can go to the spas and beauty salons. These oil people set the standard of living for families in Alberta. If the poor farm husband can not cut the mustard and provide a similar lifestyle, it can become tempting for the farm wife to look wistfully at the greener grass on the other side of the fence.

[grassfarmer]

c_b, $4000 a month looks huge to me. We don't have kids yet but we can get by on way,way less than that per month. Taking out the farm expenses, no travelling to work, no smoking or drinking leaves us with a way cheaper lifestyle. Depends on the people certainly but we have no desire to live the "high life" of oil patch workers or other high earners. I know oil guys that holiday and spend the big money in Vegas having hardly seen their spouse during the rest of the year - it's a choice everyone has to make but to me that's not an appealing lifestyle.

[grassfarmer]

And I know many people in the oil business that have young families and spend any of their spare dollars and time doing family things, like camping trips, playing ball, soccer etc. as a family, so not everyone in the oil industry lifes the high life.

I would certainly be concerned about your heating costs even if you are living in an older home. I was very concerned about the rising cost of natural gas, so had a large wood pellet heater install last October to replace a small wood heater in an addition to my home.

Pellets cost approximately $2.50 per day for my heater, which I shut completely off on warm days.

My natural gas bill for February was $67.00 and has averaged $125.00 for the winter months. I have an 1800 Sq. ft home, so certain input costs could quite possibly lower your monthly heating bill significantly.

I won't comment on the price of smoking, it is a personal choice but by making that choice a person must realize they may forego other luxuries , not to mention the cost to their health and that of their family.

My parents struggled to raise one child on a very small income, and I remember visiting an uncle in Calgary ( a medical doctor), seeing their huge mansion and hearing how much everything including my aunt's clothes had cost. I was about 10 at the time, and thought she was a very shallow person. I don't think my mom envied her, she would likely have settled for an indoor bathroom, but wasn't too concerned about the labels on her clothes !!!

If the lifestyle of other people bothered me I would find different people to hang around with vs envying what they did and had.

[ruggb]

I have always felt that many farmers tend to under estimate what they spend to live. I guess this is because the farm and personal costs tend to get mixed up somewhat.
We used to keep close track of our home expenses. This is a good exercise and I highly recommend it. If you don't know where the money goes you will soon find out. It,s higher than you think.

We don,t do this anymore just because it,s a pain and quite a bit of effort.

I do know that we spend about $3000/month (cash) for what I would call personal expenses. (Food, heat, electricity,car gas, non farm related stuff).

We are a couple in our late 50,s. no kids at home. Don't smoke. Drink very little these days. We don,t live high on the hog but niether do we penny pinch. We eat out a little ; go to the odd show etc ; drive older vehicles.
We like to travel but for the most part this would be over and above the $3000. Finding time and money to travel is a challenge.
For a family with 4 kids $4000/mo. doesn,t seem at all out of line especially if they are involved in things.

[cowman]

There is no two ways about it. It costs a lot to live!
Every thing goes up...well except for cattle and barley! How much more are we paying for electricity, natural gas, phone, satelite TV, taxes, gasoline, cars, entertainment etc.?
A family is always a struggle, but in the end probably worth it? I guess it is where your priorities lie? But yes always a struggle.
I was never a great budgetter! I always figured there has to be more to life than getting your belly full and keeping a roof over your head! I seldom cut back...just found a way to make more money! Now that doesn't mean I am not thrifty and frugal on somethings, but when I want something I usually get it!
I do understand where you younger family guys are coming from. I was there too. It isn't easy.

[dalek]

We spend about $2800/month including everything except the mortgage on the house, which I can't really separate out because it includes all of the farm buildings, 100 acres of land, and a big chunk of dairy quota. That's for 2 of us with 3 children under 3.5, 2 in diapers including a newborn. Luckily our heat is all wood from our 200 acres of woodlot. We sell the logs and burn the tops.

[dalek]

Forgot to mention both of us are still paying off student loans although that'll be done this fall.

[dalek]

dalek, it sounds like you and your spouse are excellent money managers. I know that as children get older and are in school and organized sports or other activities the cost goes up, but it sounds like you are keeping costs under control.
Wood heat is certainly a lot cheaper than natural gas, oil etc, as long as you have your own wood supply.

I was buying wood for my wood heater and the cost of pellets is about the same price for a much larger heater.

[cowman]

The really sad part is when you are young and could really use money you are usually broke trying to pay for everything...when you are older you have the money but don't need a lot of stuff!

[cowman]

That is where the satisfaction of making it on your own comes in. I personally doubt that many people who have everything handed to them are really content. Working for something, particularly on a farm and seeing it come to fruition is something that means a lot.

[WoolyBear]

""Working for something, particularly on a farm and seeing it come to fruition is something that means a lot.""

This is very true, but I'm getting pretty sick of seeing outside forces deciding our futures for us! Farmers continue to buy retail and sell wholesale, and the way things are going the only ones that will be able to farm will be those that either don't have a family, or those that choose not to keep one. For those of us that try to juggle family time, with agriculture, PLUS an off farm job, I wish them all the Good Luck I can give.

We all know farming isn't a 9-5 job, but but it would sure be nice to be able to think that someone respects what we do, AND do without.

[cswilson]

Well I have 4 kids too and I know it doesn't cost me $4,000 a month because I don't have $4,000 a month to spend. We don't live too far from town which helps but our kids are into lots of things AA hockey which I coach,all school sports,4H, rodeo etc. Nobody smokes or drinks-which helps. My wife is pretty darn thrifty also.My oldest just about has her college squirreled away too. We don't take much for big holidays-a day at the lake once in awhile-nobody seems to be suffering too much so far.

[kato]

I know every time I get to the checkout stand at the grocery store, I'm thankful my sons are grown up and off buying their own groceries!!! I also do find that I spend more on food than I would if I was not working off the farm. Convenience costs extra, but when you come home dead tired from work, then run out and help sort some cows real quick before it gets dark, that frozen pizza starts looking pretty good. LOL

My biggest economy strategy is the Geo Metro sitting in the driveway. Driving to work costs a tank of gas at about $25.00 every 10 days or so. That's travelling five miles to town, and coming home at dinner for a total of 20 miles a day. It ain't pretty, but it suits me well. My first car was a VW Beetle, and I guess that set my standards when it comes to buying high price gas.