ulcers in baby calves

[chaser]

hi have a neighbor who lost some calves to ulcers today i lost one . calves are almost 2 months old. i lost some last year to had vet chek. were do these ulcers come from? how can it be prevented? what can be used to treat? thanks

[grassfarmer]

I'd guess the answer you will get is its from drinking
dirty puddle water and being in muddy corrals. Most
advocate offering diatomaceous earth to prevent it.
I prefer to have calves nowhere near mud. Calving out
on banked grass or pastures with a lot of residual left
over from last year gets rid of problems like this as
well as many others.

[ALLFARMER]

One guy up here lost 17 traced it too cow
manure/run off water running into dugout water
supply. With the rain, snow mud and wind we are
having our worst year. We will be starting calving
about May 15th next year. They were predicting
munus 15 for tomorrow night and plus 18 in a few
days so 33 degree temperature difference!
Thankfully its -12 predicted now over night.

[SADIE]

From a medical perspective.

Abomasal ulcers & Hairball in calves 3 wks up to 8 weeks is very common. Our practice got quite involved in these animals during my practice years from 1976-95.

The producer usually starts by finding a calf or two dead and brings them in for autopsy and we find the abomasum with perforated ulcer---then peritonitis. Closer looking at the animal "rolled hairballs" are often found. Some calves have "sand" in the abomasum where those ranches have sandy land "grass". We saw a problem when producers put cow calf pairs out on "Stubble"---the abomasum was full of "Dirt balls" and mud.

Soon those producers saw the earlier clinical signs in calves of this age.

The calf that is "bloated" or kicking at their stomachs were brought into us. These calves at 3 wks to 6 weeks of age with "bloat". We soon did right side surgeries on these animals. Hooked them up to IV fluids and incision was "percostal" on the right side. The abomasum was exteriorized and the "rotten contents" with hairballs drained so that nothing leaks into the abdomen.

Some of these animals showed ulcers in the gut wall. Those areas were resected. Abomasum closed up with a couple of calfspan placed inside. Caught early and the results were very favorable.

Producers that tried to reduce bloat with mineral oil and diotyl in these little calves are not very successful.
They are poor candidates for surgery after those products were admisistered.

Out practice did many calves each spring for hairball surgery.

Abomasal ulcers and hairballs is a syndrome that is discussed at veterinary circles and colleges to this day. Some springs are worse than others.

[grassfarmer]

Allfarmer, I wouldn't be too quick to change calving
date based on one abnormally late spring. Starting
mid May will bring its own set of challenges. A lot of
your calves will be born in June and that's not a
month I like calving in. Way too much protein in the
grass can lead to too much milk, scouring calves,
quicker dehydration of scouring calves due to hotter
days, calves hiding in long grass where you can't find
them or check them so easy.
Then on the other end of summer if you are in an
area prone to drought you might be getting short of
grass before the cows are all bred back, the calves
might be getting shorted milk before they are very
big and then what do you do with the calves? Seems
you sell calves in the fall so you are going to be
selling a lot less weight or if you decide to leave them
on the cows for part of the winter that puts your cow
feeding costs considerably.

[kato]

Ulcers are a tough problem, especially since the first diagnosis is usually at an autopsy.

We try and make sure our calves have good hay to eat, and not just scraps from around the hay feeders that the cows don't want. The calves get a nice bale in the shed, where the cows can't get at it. They also get diatomaceous earth, and minerals in there.

Our theory is that a calf with more than just milk in it's stomach will always be more able to deal with all these issues that show up when the mud season starts.

SADIE, I've often wondered if an early clostridial vaccination would make a difference with this ulcer issue. What's your opinion on that?

[SADIE]

Management conditions to minimize Abomasal Ulcer/hairball, sand/dirt abomasal ulcer issues.

This is just IMHEXPERIENCE & IMHO????

1)Turn cow/calf pairs out on a clean/carpet landscape (IF & WHEN POSSIBLE). Even grassland that isn't growing yet.

2)Avoid stubblelands,corrals that get too concentrated that are wet/mucky.

Kato---the clostridial vaccination issue in neonates. I often seen the clostridial infection around a neonate from the castration rings on the sacs of bull calves. Concerned about vaccination of the sucking calf and when those antibodies theoretically should be coming to the calf through the colostrum of the dam.

Colstridial prevention from the castration ring issue seemed to be prevented when an antibiotic was given when the calves were ringed.

Back to the abomasal ulcer and hairball issue. Some producers got very good at early detection of these animals. Slight abdominal discomfort, looking back at belly, standing alone with dam close by away from rest of herd. Slight kicking at bellies, about 12 hours later comes the bloat stage. Stand behind those animals and tap their abdomen ---"tight as a drum". When we got them in the clinic relieve the gas typany first by a needle in the right side of the abdomen (No rumen developed as yet). decrease the discomfort and then the surgery procedure.

I hope this helps to those that inquired. manybe something can be done at the management level of these cow-calf pairs.

[Horse]

Myself I always liked shorthorn cows, but that hairy udder seemed to have more than thier fair share of hair balls in calves. I wonder if limo would be better as they have a high short haired udder?

[grassfarmer]

You got it at #1 Sadie! preventative management.

Horse, my cows are hairier than any Shorthorn you've
ever seen and we never, ever get this problem.

[ALLFARMER]

Our best calving has been calving on grass that
has just greened up. Yes I know that's the worst
time to graze but like Kato was saying a mixed
diet for calves is great. Right now it's mumma's
milk or nothin. Looks like finally this week the
snow will go and we will be able to get cows out of
corrals.

[littledoggie]

We had a problem with this a few years back. There seemed to be a link between a clostridial infection and heavy milking moms. The vet told us that there could be a genetic link as well. We identified one cow in particular that had a couple of deaths in her baby calves and a couple of deaths due to bloating in her calves once in the feedlot. We got rid of her line and haven't had a problem with this since (in baby calves, anyway). The bull could also carry this defective gene.

[gaucho]

Sorry but I don't know why these things take so much debate... Calve on stockpiled grass, at the end of April / 1st part of may so that you have 75% calves born by the May long weekend and so the calves have enough age on them to deal with thew milk that GF talks about... get then out and keep them out of the shit and corrals and guess what most things can be prevented... at least that's what happens around our neck of the woods

[ALLFARMER]

I said a couple years ago we would never calve in
the corrals again. Calving on grass and running
around with the quad tagging calves is the way for
us to calve. The very late spring has forced us to
calve again in the virtual hell that is corral calving.
Daily running the bale shredder around bedding.
Cows trying to steal calves. Standing crappy
water. Cows not mothering up good. Freezing
calves.

In my view my biggest mistake was trying to time
calving to close to spring.

[kato]

We calve in corrals, and have no complaints. The trick is to have big enough corrals that there is not a crowding issue. We have three big pens with three big sheds. No cows allowed in the sheds. By this time of year there is enough straw that there are dry places to sleep, and the cows stay clean. It doesn't matter really what kind of weather gets thrown at us, because we're set up to handle it. Our problems start when we let them out and a freaky late spring storm comes along. Which is why they haven't been let out yet. We're getting a freaky storm today.

It works for us. And it will work better for us this fall, when we have calves big enough to sell without putting any grain into them.

And to get back to the topic of the thread, we don't have ulcer issues either. I still think giving the calves something to fill their bellies is a major part of prevention.