Are you HAPPY with the system?

[ValueChainFX]

I would like to know how many beef producers are happy with the way the industry is working today.

What would you like to see to improve the industry? (We all want higher prices so this is a given K)

Make some suggestions let's get some positives on the table here!

Happy New Year

[lonewolf]

Under the new trace back system I have concerns that when a problem occurs the first place that the slaughter houses start looking is at the primary producer. ie the cow-calf producer. I would like to see a system where integrity runs both ways. My understanding is that when my calves leave my farm without auction barns monitor tags the primary producer has a very difficult time to find out exactly where and how many yards his cattle end up in before being slaughtered.

I wish there was a system that would get infomation back to the primary producer on how their carcasses graded out.

We are being asked to start to produce consistant beef and I feel that this information would be helpful in starting to help accomplish this. I will grant you right now that there may be variability from feedlot to backgrounder due to variable feed inputs, but it is a place to start.

[flatbroke]

I couldn't have said it better, lonewolf! It seems to inevitably be the Canadian way to use a large stick over the head instead of a carrot in front of our noses. I remember reading about just such a program in some western states (voluntary) wherin the producer is provided with carcass information in exchange for participation in the I.D. program. My concern is the same as lonewolf's- The most likely place for an animal to pick up a disease, by far, is in the feedlot, but everytime something shows up, guess who will ALWAYS be the frontline to deal with government inspectors? Animals could always be traced back in the reverse (and logical) order. Why the hell did we have to "fix" something that wasn't broken? ...wouldn't have anything to do with the fact the majority of ACC members are feeders and not cow-calf producers, would it?
Happy new year :-)

[flatbroke]

...my apologies VCFX, you did ask for positives... I promise I'll post something positive as soon as I can come up with it... ;-)

[rodbradshaw]

Flatbroke

The reason for the tags was that CFIA could start at both ends. This is not a witch hunt for the cow-calf producer but a way to eliminate alot of unnecessary leg work by only working back from when the problem is found. Dave Solverson from Camrose area told a story about the traceback they were involved with under the old system. They had to round up their cattle off pasture, bring them home and then repeat the whole exercise a week or so later. As it turned out the cattle that caused the problem did not come from their farm. If the tag system had been in place they would have automatically been eliminated from the trace back.

It is funny that most people feel that Alberta Beef Producers (formerly ACC) are all cattle feeders when most of the Alberta Cattle Feeders Assoc. feel that they are all cow-calf people.

We have to treat this as an industry and all do our part otherwise we will lose the confidence of the consumer.

[ValueChainFX]

Well guys you are all right so far, I have worked on trace back through the whole system long before it was looked at by anyone! We have formed an alliance to do just that .... trace the animal all the way through the system, including who has handled it and how, plus we are determined to include all components of the supply chain AND provide feedback to the producers not only on grade but on yields and customer satisfaction (the end user) as well.
We are in the process of finalizing our agreement, but we already know the components we are going to put in place (for the most part) At this point in time we have many breeds that are already signed up for the program, several that have agreed in principal to sign and many independents that would like to run Branded (as in market brands) programs. I agree that the producer should not be the only one that has a big stick over their heads, in fact my thought is that we should all work together so the big stick is an incentive rather than a deterrent.
I will post a message here probably next week when we have formally dotted the i's and crossed the t's.

[flatbroke]

OK, I've obviously missed something...
Let's say my calves leave the yard in feb, through the sale barn and into a backgrounding lot, then on to another yard for finishing. Then, we'll mix them, say, in the finishing lot with other calves with T.B. They then test positive at the slaughterhouse. How exactly will ID tags "automatically eliminate" me from the traceback process? Seems to me just the opposite to be true. ...And don't worry- the big stick IS an incentive! As Gene hackman put it ... You can get a horse to deal cards if you've got a stock-prod shoved far enough up his (rear end)... It's just a matter of voltage. How many cards would you like? ;-)

[rodbradshaw]

Flatbroke
If calves from your place test positive at slaughter you are going to get audited, but under the old system if your calves did not have T.B. at slaughter but had been through the senario that you described it would be all lots that were sold to that feedlot, say over a month all the people that contributed to sales at auction marts where that lot had been bought because you wouldn't necessarily know what animals went where (especially with the popularity of presort sales, and livestock dealers). The net has to be cast fairly wide to get back to the source. Now in that same scenario, if your calves didn't have it but were in with calves that did, you would be eliminated from the trace back. It is simply away to eliminate a lot of possibilities by starting at both ends of the chain.
The system is not perfect but hopefully it will eliminate a lot of innocent herds. It would be nice if you could get carcass data, and it is coming but for now it is only used for the traceback of reportable diseases.

Hopefully I haven't muddied the water to much.

[rusty1]

I can understand the primary producers for feeling like lifes unfair with the CCIA - tagging requirments. What I don't understand is why the producers groups are so melie mouthed about who should pay for it. If it is a national security issue as I believe it is, then the process should be born by all Canadians. If the unthinkable happened the ripple effect would go far beyond the farm gate. I don't relly think it's cacable as to how far it would impact the public, therefore it is in everybodys best interest to have the systyem in place, therefore everyone should be responsible to help cover the cost.
That being said there are huge economic benifets to be gained by those that use the opportunity of individualy serial numbered calves.
With our projects on the go we expect to gain approx. $50 per head margin and maybe more. So one might spend his time figuring out how to make the most of the situation.

[cakadu]

Rusty - that is a question that I have asked with various people in the different levels of government. When is this going to become a social issue and not just one of the producer paying for it.

And I want to make it perfectly clear from the outset that I am ALL FOR food safety. I just don't understand why someone who is a direct marketer, who will never play in the export game has to be subjected to the same rules and regulations as the guy who runs a 50,000 head feedlot with the animals destined for the export market. There has to be degrees of compliance, with the bottom line being that it cannot and should not come solely from the producers pocket.

If we were just producing enough beef for our own domestic supply and not concerned with gaining more of the export market, which by the way I'm still trying to get my head around what with the Country of origin thing with the U.S. and the fact that at some stage in the not too distant future, our South American friends are going to be able to export beef all over, would we have all of these food safety controls in place.

If we are being asked by the federal government to do all of these things to put Canada in a position of food safety excellence, shouldn't they be willing to help PAY to get us there? I'm really curious to hear the opinions out there.