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Jul 25, 2022 | 12:59 1 I for one am really getting tired of someone shitting on how i farm
we follow labels to a tee on chemicals .we spray as a last resort , only if necessary
this bullshit thread that has been left on here for three years , and 95 % of the replys are by the author , should of been removed long ago
personal opinions should not be marketed as fact
I am sick of their bullshit
will get pics as soon as possible of these "organic" messes here and post them
please post yours so the woke sheeple can see the shit they're eating
apologies to the very few organic farmers that put their heart and soul into it and do a good job , but you are few and far between
oxymoron of the day "chinese organic" Reply With Quote

  • helmsdale's Avatar Jul 25, 2022 | 13:47 2 One local organic family here has transitioned out. They could not manage the serious soil erosion from 4-5 passes of conventional tillage on a 50-50 operation, so they tried to go continuous. They dropped serious amounts of rock phos in order to boost their phos content, then tried to bring their N component up by buying 100's of tridem loads of cow shit, pig shit, and chicken shit. All of that comes with copious amounts of weed seeds and it got to the point where they were growing 20bu crops that after cleaning were net 8-10.

    Wild Oats by and large took over every acre! Kochia was completely unmanageable! Buckwheat was a nightmare!

    Perhaps their are areas where it can be done longer term, but for here you MAYBE get 2 or 3 years of tolerably dirty grain after the 3 year transition has taken place.

    I'd say they tried it all. They'd work ahead of the seeder. Then used a 3 bar cultivator with double disc openers attached in the place of harrows to get another stab at the weeds at seeding time. They seeded 2-2.5x heavier than necessary then harrowed a couple weeks after it came up hoping to thin out the weeds yet again.

    They're damned good people, but nobody enjoyed farming beside them as weeds from theirs ended up blessing yours. Reply With Quote
  • 1 Like


  • Jul 25, 2022 | 13:52 3 Hired a guy that used to work for an “organic” farm. He said they were putting fertilizer on and spraying chemical at night. The owner told him not to say anything to anybody.

    You would never tell by the crops he was getting. They were still horrible to none existent amongst the plethora of weeds.

    And people are paying premium for this garbage? Reply With Quote
    Jul 25, 2022 | 14:11 4 The neighbor's organic wheat is solid orange with wild mustard in full bloom. It will look that way until the flowers fall off in a week or two. Most people assume that it is canola growing. Reply With Quote
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  • Jul 25, 2022 | 14:16 5 anybody that thinks enough food can be produced organicaly to feed the world is clueless ! they deserve to go hungry Reply With Quote

  • jazz's Avatar Jul 25, 2022 | 15:19 6 Have a neighbour running just 8Q. He isn’t organic but strict half and half. Seeds with discer yet. Does conventional tillage on the other half but waits for a rain before he goes in. Not out of control but weeds end up being pretty big before he gets in. Reply With Quote
    Jul 25, 2022 | 15:24 7 A guy beside me tried for about 20 years. His fields got worse and worse over the years with Canada thistle and wild oats and every other weed. Hardly any crop most years. He finally gave up and has gone back to the bad way but you can still tell which fields are his by the weeds that still grow there.
    Sorry no pictures. Reply With Quote
    Jul 25, 2022 | 15:48 8 Son of the local organic guy of 30 yrs asked me to spray his barley this yr. Exact words were I want at least one crop in my life I can be proud to have farmed and drive by.

    full of wild oats, buckwheat and sow thistel. couldn't see his barley. I'll get a after photo in a couple days when I'm back off shift. Reply With Quote
    Jul 25, 2022 | 15:53 9 I always wonder why the organic people generally do things the same and expect better results than the feeble efforts most put forth. Many start off using hay as a transition. Fine, Starts them out clean with decent fertility. And then the tillage and mining begins for twenty years.

    Why not do a couple years of grain, a diverse cover crop, grazed intensively, back to alfalfa, couple years of grain? Why not sweet clover or alfalfa, or red clover for seed, rather than a plowdown or crazy summerfallow? Why not use a roller crimper instead of mass tillage implements? There are guys in the states using roller crispers following cover crops and no tilling into that mulch organically, why not here? Do better with less land because you can focus on it while a quarter of your land base is in hay?

    Use fall rye and winter wheat to your advantage, stop trying to grow more than a couple years of grains with zero inputs.

    Of course it’s always easy to look on the outside in, but simple half n half isn’t enough. I have grown some wild crops after alfalfa with no N, and minimal need to spray, often to the point of wondering if I should even spray. Same for rye and winter wheat, which beat most weeds by miles. With a little bit of care, one can keep former hayland wild oat free for many years.

    It’s frustrating because I think it CAN be done better than 90% do it. I don’t get it I guess?
    Last edited by Sheepwheat; Jul 25, 2022 at 15:57.
    Reply With Quote

  • Jul 25, 2022 | 16:24 10
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheepwheat View Post
    I always wonder why the organic people generally do things the same and expect better results than the feeble efforts most put forth. Many start off using hay as a transition. Fine, Starts them out clean with decent fertility. And then the tillage and mining begins for twenty years.

    Why not do a couple years of grain, a diverse cover crop, grazed intensively, back to alfalfa, couple years of grain? Why not sweet clover or alfalfa, or red clover for seed, rather than a plowdown or crazy summerfallow? Why not use a roller crimper instead of mass tillage implements? There are guys in the states using roller crispers following cover crops and no tilling into that mulch organically, why not here? Do better with less land because you can focus on it while a quarter of your land base is in hay?

    Use fall rye and winter wheat to your advantage, stop trying to grow more than a couple years of grains with zero inputs.

    Of course it’s always easy to look on the outside in, but simple half n half isn’t enough. I have grown some wild crops after alfalfa with no N, and minimal need to spray, often to the point of wondering if I should even spray. Same for rye and winter wheat, which beat most weeds by miles. With a little bit of care, one can keep former hayland wild oat free for many years.

    It’s frustrating because I think it CAN be done better than 90% do it. I don’t get it I guess?
    In my neck of the woods most of the guys who went organic were/ are going broke and couldn't afford to buy chemicals. That's why they went organic .I do have one organic neighbor who is a good organic farmer and practices good summer fallow. Dad used to use the saying that you cant summer fallow in the spring ahead of seeding. There is a local guy who will use a disk to roll down the thistle and quack grass and seed into the mess expecting a crop. They are not close to me but I have a organic friend who has a lot of alfalfa seeded down to ground to build organic matter and some nitrogen. This is for several years at a time. It seems the local organic neighbors don't have enough for diesel at times. They will work some of the fallow and inexplicitly leave other fields alone for the canada thistle to blow all over. Most of the organic guys too are what one guy said are the "bottom feeders" when it comes to buying farm machinery. You just don't seem to see any newer farm implements at all. I heard of one guy who would pull in with a harrow bar, back it up to fold it out then after lowering it , would move the tires from the transport wheels to the field side. Did this on every field move. I know new iron isn't the be all end all but it shouldn't be all junk. Unfortunately most organic guys are out of the business after a few years. We have bought several quarters over the years of certified organic land that needed a lot of TLC to bring them back to a productive state. Better organic examples would for sure be welcome. Reply With Quote
    Jul 25, 2022 | 16:26 11 Common denominator of success with organic is having livestock and a majority of acres in perennial stands or short term covers utilized by the livestock. Sold a plow years ago to some ranchers doing just that, selling organic oats. Even such if that is the way they want it we’ll be hard pressed to feed ourselves. Reply With Quote

  • Landdownunder's Avatar Jul 25, 2022 | 16:41 12 One chap here did it well.

    Sowed on 15 inch rows.

    Relying on cultivation of course.

    Once crop was up and going used to cultivate again between the crows at say 5 leaf stage of crop.

    Rare as rocking horse shit in my area being so dry. Reply With Quote
    Jul 25, 2022 | 17:21 13 I was organic farming for twenty years, and it is possible, but i was hampered by neighbouring land in trees and set aside that blew thistles and docks all over me.
    90% of people that go organic have zero farming knowledge so are doomed to fail.
    I still farm organic land, but i get paid to do it.
    My own is conventional Reply With Quote

  • SASKFARMER's Avatar Jul 25, 2022 | 20:53 14 Name:  C60D6341-E88C-453F-88C5-0F52BA0C46F6.jpg
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    Organic peas working to save man kind from starving.

    **** me we will all be dead if we counted on these guys. Reply With Quote

  • blackpowder's Avatar Jul 25, 2022 | 22:15 15 I don't know of any organic farms at all. Thought that was a pre bankruptcy trend from the 80s.
    Grazing would be the only sustainable zero man made input agriculture I can think of for this area. Reply With Quote
  • 1 Like


  • Jul 26, 2022 | 08:00 16
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheepwheat View Post
    I always wonder why the organic people generally do things the same and expect better results than the feeble efforts most put forth. Many start off using hay as a transition. Fine, Starts them out clean with decent fertility. And then the tillage and mining begins for twenty years.

    Why not do a couple years of grain, a diverse cover crop, grazed intensively, back to alfalfa, couple years of grain? Why not sweet clover or alfalfa, or red clover for seed, rather than a plowdown or crazy summerfallow? Why not use a roller crimper instead of mass tillage implements? There are guys in the states using roller crispers following cover crops and no tilling into that mulch organically, why not here? Do better with less land because you can focus on it while a quarter of your land base is in hay?

    Use fall rye and winter wheat to your advantage, stop trying to grow more than a couple years of grains with zero inputs.

    Of course it’s always easy to look on the outside in, but simple half n half isn’t enough. I have grown some wild crops after alfalfa with no N, and minimal need to spray, often to the point of wondering if I should even spray. Same for rye and winter wheat, which beat most weeds by miles. With a little bit of care, one can keep former hayland wild oat free for many years.

    It’s frustrating because I think it CAN be done better than 90% do it. I don’t get it I guess?
    The absolute most important thing for success in organic farming is ROTATION. In that rotation you need to have cover crops involved for both weed management and nutrient input, which is also something we are seeing in conventional farming now as well. When you start to talk about regenerative/sustainable/carbon neutral, you are going to see organic production practices being implemented into conventional farming, but really only the ones that are actually working. The organic certifying bodies are supposed to be working with the producers to ensure that they are putting good rotations and practices in place, but all too often they are just there to take their money...
    I have been working with both conv and organic over the past 30 years, and there are good and bad producers on both sides... it's just far more apparent when the organic ones are doing a sh** job...
    Not saying don't rag on your neighbors that are growing more weeds than crop, just wanted to point a few things out... Reply With Quote

  • Jul 26, 2022 | 08:47 17 Parsley’s organic farm was awesome and I am pretty sure it was very profitable. Everything was row cultivated and beans podded like I’ve never seen and probably never will see again.👍 I’m sure Parsley could fill us in. Reply With Quote
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  • Aug 3, 2022 | 17:13 18 Name:  82385459-ACF8-42E1-87BF-43AA44A38B8F.jpg
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    “Organic “ oat field !!
    Should feed a couple people? Reply With Quote
  • 1 Like


  • Aug 3, 2022 | 19:06 19
    Quote Originally Posted by caseih View Post
    Name:  82385459-ACF8-42E1-87BF-43AA44A38B8F.jpg
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    “Organic “ oat field !!
    Should feed a couple people?
    Man, hey?

    Not too far away there is a guy who ran cows on a half section of Stoney bush. A few years ago he ripped out the bush, and started seeding it. Organically. It is a terrible mess. Like your pictures but worse even. What a waste. He produced far more calories with the cows, used the poor land (grey wooded with nearly zero natural productivity), way better. Trying to eke out nitrogen from a half job of summerfallow, from soil with one or maybe two per cent OM max, is folly.

    Further down the road, there is an organic oat crop, following alfalfa. Clean. Looks like it’ll do 80 or so IMO. Same soil type. Different amount of effort.

    And it shows. THere is a better way. Too bad 90% don’t seem to realize it. Again, I don’t get it. Reply With Quote

  • Aug 5, 2022 | 23:26 20 Most organic field weed messes are worked up here yet again
    Crop ins must be lenient with them ? Reply With Quote
    Aug 6, 2022 | 06:38 21
    Quote Originally Posted by caseih View Post
    Most organic field weed messes are worked up here yet again
    Crop ins must be lenient with them ?
    How does Scic work for organic growers. I assume they pay a premium just like the normal conventional farmer, but is there money “pooled” with the conventional growers to keep their payouts coming? Or are their premiums/payout separated?

    Just wondering if they are being paid out more than contributing.. more curious than anything. Reply With Quote
    SASKFARMER's Avatar Aug 6, 2022 | 07:22 22 organic flax

    Reply With Quote
    jazz's Avatar Aug 6, 2022 | 07:42 23 Lets clear up the organic market illusion once and for all. The only people buying organic anything are urban Karens who watch CNN and CBC. Thats a pretty small market for $50 flax and $30 wheat. Most likely these consumers are anti GMO too, pro climate hysteria, gluten free, anti meat etc.

    This is the last group of people I want to fight weeds for.

    Most of our production is landing in china, Japan, India, sub saharan Africa, ME, where no Karens are found. Reply With Quote
    Partners's Avatar Aug 6, 2022 | 07:56 24 Wife, daughter, and grand daughter are all Gluten intolerant..
    We never buy organic..
    Many other options .. Reply With Quote
    Aug 6, 2022 | 08:54 25 Once in a while we end up with organic produce, simply because we are price conscious and it is at times cheaper than regular.

    Our lamb could be certified organic, but we don’t see the advantage of certifying it. A lot of our co-vendors at farmers markets are organic, and do a brisk business. But it’s easier and far more feasible to raise organic garlic on ten acres and do a very good job with the same yields as conventional, than grain farming.

    I would wager most of our personal gardens are basically organic.

    Don’t confuse organic grain farming with the many other types of farming. Small scale organic is pretty simple, viable, and sustainable.

    Remember, one is still a farmer even if one is not a grain farmer with a lot of acres!

    I get a kick out of hunters who chat it up about their organic wild game. I didn’t know wild game ate only from organic farmers fields. Ha. Reply With Quote

  • Aug 6, 2022 | 10:25 26 I swear my crops looked organic before spraying. Would have been a terrible year for organic guys with the amount of thistles and foxtail. Wet year after a drought almost sets you back years of weed control organic or conventional. Reply With Quote
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  • jazz's Avatar Aug 6, 2022 | 11:36 27
    Quote Originally Posted by WiltonRanch View Post
    I swear my crops looked organic before spraying. Would have been a terrible year for organic guys with the amount of thistles and foxtail. Wet year after a drought almost sets you back years of weed control organic or conventional.
    We have used by the book chem this year and we still have some weed issues. Thats what a season skewed by an entire month can do. Cant even imagine fighting weeds without chem this yr. Reply With Quote
    Austranada's Avatar Aug 7, 2022 | 02:21 28
    Quote Originally Posted by Partners View Post
    Wife, daughter, and grand daughter are all Gluten intolerant..
    We never buy organic..
    Many other options ..
    https://doctordavidfriedman.com/blog/glyphosate-the-cause-of-gluten-intolerance Reply With Quote
    Aug 7, 2022 | 07:41 29
    Quote Originally Posted by Austranada View Post
    https://doctordavidfriedman.com/blog/glyphosate-the-cause-of-gluten-intolerance
    Also causes global warming and Russia invasion of Ukraine. Reply With Quote

  • Austranada's Avatar Aug 7, 2022 | 08:08 30
    Quote Originally Posted by agstar77 View Post
    Also causes global warming and Russia invasion of Ukraine.
    Supply the peer reviewed studies, citations etc or stick your head back up your ãss asstar Reply With Quote