feed wheat v oil price

[ianben]

As oil reaches new highs daily and Tom and Charlie talk $50-$70 feed wheat.
Where do these two prices meet?
What is energy value of a ton of wheat using current oil price.
Can you replace that tonne for $50-$70 next year with higher fuel and fert costs.

We are in same position here Poor harvest weather lots of feed wheat £50 -£70/tonne fuel up from 15p to 25p and climbing N from £110 to £151 and climing.

No way can I replace the wheat in the bin for todays sale prices.

[melvill]

Gld you're back ianben. I was beginning to think you'd retired or moved to one of the isolated islands off the northern UK coast.

[TOM4CWB]

Ianben;

We have done ruff calculations that our feed wheat is worth about $3.50/bu in heating value.

Coal is still way cheaper... of course it does not burn as cleanly we are told.

There is an obvious value that is being overlooked... but at $40/t US wheat here is being stolen... by any standards.

Any wonder why every country in the world is mad at the CWB?

How can anyone at the CWB claim they are extracting a premium at these prices?

[ianben]

Thanks Melville, never been away just not had anything to say.
However we are back to one of those situations where oversupply in one sector through uncontrolable events scupper rational marketing.

Risk management as you and Charlie teach can help I agree. Tom is a covert and believes with his knowledge can do better than the CWB.

None of us alone seem able to manage these unforseen, yet unfortunatly all to common, events in agriculture.
A small percentage over supply leading to a unrelated crash in price.
I do not blame customers and to say the are stealing is wrong the market is oversupplied. Someone somewhere is selling before the price drops even lower and wether CWB makes this worse or not I wonder. Do more small individuals panicing drop prices faster than one large institution?

Farmers need a way to manage supply know the value of their produce, and also produce what is wanted. BSE is one of these events. An open border with no reduction in numbers is not a solution.
18 months and customers will have moved on as we learnt the hard way.
Farmers need to find alternative uses for what we produce. Oil price rises and uncertain supply must be an opertunity but how can I as an individual take advantage.
I can see the multi-fuel industrial burner with an oil tank on one side and a grain hoppper on the other in my local town.I wish this is were governments would help with a solution not a subsidy. Your neighbour who does not want your beef is willing to go to war for oil. Ethanol piped to the south?
Your wheat$3.50/bu crosses the border Tom without anyone going to jail CWB law suites or tariffs.

[tower]

sounds like Murray McLaughlin's song about combines ganging up to take all of the bread. I think we should see an anti-trust inquiry into the grain companies, and their control of the marketplace.

As I understand it there is a lower grain stock to use ratio since back in the early 70's. and the lowest prices to farmers. Doesn't make economic sense to me.

[TOM4CWB]

Ianben;

That the CWB is "forced" into offering feed wheat prices of $1.57/buCDN in itself identifies the issue.

Clearly our feed wheat COSTS at least double this to produce... so dumping is occuring according to WTO/US trade definitions.

That the CWB quotes such a price as $1.57/buCDN proves the point of every other country in the world in WTO negotiations... the CWB has no cost of sales... and will sell at any price below the cost of production without a second thought.

On another point but related... as I was signing up nominations for the CWB election... one cowboy looked and smirked at me when I aked for his nomination... "You don't really think I would sign that?" he asked... indicating between the lines it was against his own interests.

It has been stated many times in the past two weeks that the DOC tarrif on hogs will not hurt the hog farmer for now... as feed wheat will just go lower.

We grain growers are at the bottom of the chain... and for now held there by the CWB.

It is my opportunity to change this... so the CWB can help instead of holding us down.

Jake Hoeppener got an afidavit; sworn from the CWB last week; swearing that the buy-back difference on CWB export licenses he obtained... went to the grain co's... not the CWB pool account.

What a tangled web we weave!

[Incognito]

Careful quoting Jake, Tom. He is one Tom Clancy novel away from reality.
Friend of mine once said: "you are only as good as your network".

Choose your network wisely.

[ianben]

Tom I suport and admire anyone who is prepared to work for change and common- sence.

Any wheat sold by for less than its energy value must not only be a loss to the guy who produced it but also a loss to the country that produced it.

Is your government and countrymen aware that CWB is selling half price energy?

[ianben]

Here is a piece I found by searching corn burning boilers
Biomass Boiler Plant
Product Brochure (PDF) (PDF Download)
Introduction
Large public buildings are generally heated with a traditional centralized boiler plant that utilizes fuel oil or natural gas as the primary fuel source. Fossil fuels are not considered renewable, and as such emit additive quantities of emissions including sulpher dioxide, nitrogen dioxide and carbon dioxide. As fossil fuels become more costly and our air emissions regulation becomes stricter, a need to have domestic fuel sources that are renewable and clean becomes more important. While several types of biomass are utilized on a small scale, such as wood chips, wood pellets, sawdust and other forest industry by-products, none of these are readily available for use in any part of the country. The ideal choice renewable fuel is dried yellow corn, currently utilized for feed in the agricultural industry. Yellow corn flows smoothly in augur systems, is readily available, is inexpensive when compare to fossil fuel, is renewable, does not contaminate the ground or ground water, is non-explosive and is abundant. Bio-fuels Fact Sheet (PDF download)

Coal boiler plant technology is currently utilized for biomass based boiler plants, and is the basis for fuel handling, fuel combustion and waste removal. Biomass boiler plant technology is very reliable, inexpensive and readily available. Boiler plants can be as small as 25 horsepower, and as large as 45,000 horsepower, which fits a majority of commercial, industrial and public education facilities.

Features
Integrates with existing fossil fuel boilers
Auxiliary fossil fuel burner system for back-up fuel supply
Fully compatible with all energy management systems
UL Listed
Normal maintenance as fossil fuel based boiler plants

Biomass Boiler Plant Benefits
Renewable fuel source
Reduced emissions
Environmentally friendly
Fuel is price stable
Improved air quality
Installation costs competitive
Excellent return on investment

Now someone has already done the R&D

How do we do the real marketing?

You know-ADVERTISING
The mail shots
The free plugs on the radio and TV
The paid for advert in press TV and radio.

Then the sale and instalation and of course the guarentee and back up.

These boilers exist but no-one wants a wingeing farmer as a partner who acuses customers of stealing and protesting about unfair trading.

Farmer get fleaced wether we are at the bottom or top of the chain because we are not organised or professional in the way we do business.

We cannot survive alone no-matter how well we manage risk. The bottom of the chain is not the worst place to be if one can be organised and professional.

Everyone elses profit depends on us supplying the raw material.

We just need to KNOW its value ourselves

[TOM4CWB]

Ianben;

THis is the very point that needs stressing on CWB marketing. The CWB MUST become the innovator to spawn value for farmers... as the marketer who is supposed to know value and process.

BUT; would maximising grain farmers returns REALLY be in the best interests of Paul Martins ships, Railways, grain co's elevators?

Any wonder why there has not been CWB reform?

[ianben]

Yeah BP reports record quaterly profits making over £1,000000/hour

I suppose Alberta will be cashing in too

Lobbying is easy with that amount of clout!

Oil has a lot to teach us though look how they continual find new uses for oil
If oil was solely used for transport they would be way over produced just like us.
Plastic is another area grain can replace oil our HGCA is promoting a wheat based product which can replace polystyrene in packaging and of course biodegadable and green.Corn being used in US too I believe with some success.

This product is very price competative but again customers have supply and deadline worries

Very hard to get something like this to the market without corparate size funds and back-up.

[TOM4CWB]

Ianben;

You are sooo right... bang on.

In 6 months time oil could be back to $25/brl., then economics would dictate a totally different answer to our problem.

We need to invest more as primary producers in our marketing/value added industries... which enlarge the market for our grain products.

US corn and soy growers are good examples of those who choose to create a better market through innovative investment and political lobby efforts!

[ianben]

When you get elected to CWB Tom would you try to change it to a more broader based organisation who could champion promote and perhaps even back these ideas or do you just want to see the end of the single market?

Can I get a vote for writing on here?

[TOM4CWB]

Ianben;

You get my vote... for a good sport with a big heart!

[TOM4CWB]

Ianben;

On your question of my motivation...

The "Single Desk" is a ficticious entity in the first place.

WHY?

Seed grain gets licenses free for domestic and export trade;

Processed feed with wheat and barley is given free export licenses;

The CWB can give an export license to anyone at any time for any reason. No CWB Act clause creates the single desk... it is a simple license denial right. In fact the CWB only has the obligation to market grain, "offered" to the CWB following, section 32 of the CWB Act.

Therefore my objection has always been the misuse of the CWB Act by the CWB.

At my web site "www.tom4cwb.com" I explain that I believe a good reason to deny an export license... would be that a farmer wanted to undercut the CWB, and sell below that farms' cost of production.

Since the price inside and outside Canada under NAFTA is the same... the individual farmer cannot create a pecuniary benefit enuring to a farmer who has produce not in the legal ownership of the CWB in the first place.

Grain Merchants who buy the farmers grain... at the CWB quoted price (whether that be the initial or PPO fixed price) are required to pay the pecuniary benefit enuring the applicant... because these entities did not pay market price in the first place. THIS IS IN LAW the "Single DESK"... grain in commercial trade... graded with CGC grades.

A farmers own produce... ungraded... not offered to the CWB... is not in the realm of trade and commerce... and does not pass to CWB authority till it is offered to the CWB respecting Section 32 of the CWB Act.

Clear as mud?

Let me say this.

We must respect private property... and the right of the farmer to own and profit from the produce grown on that farms own property!

Then we can work for the greater good of all... which would mean dumping grain at below fair market value... below the cost of production should not be allowed. If this grain is dumped... penalties will likely be placed upon all farmers in western Canada... and this hurts all farmers. License needs to be denied. I support this use of the "Single Desk"!