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Tesla Megapack

Sep 17, 2020 | 08:17 1 Ventura county is installing a huge battery pack to replace polluting and expensive peaker plants. The company is expected to save $100,000,000 by switching to battery storage.

Despite Agriville generally disagreeing with any sort of non fossil powered anything, the project is going ahead. Must have been a tough decision for them given all the expertise here.

https://electrek.co/2020/07/29/tesla...k-project-pge/

Hybridized systems and slow incorporation of renewables is the future. BP has said we have probably hit peak oil in 2019 and its time to look to change. Big risks, but big rewards as well.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/14/busin...rus/index.html Reply With Quote
Sep 17, 2020 | 08:27 2 What’s being missed about alternative energy is that it will improve its efficiency with time. One of the reasons it hasn’t forwarded as much as it should have is that world leaders recognize once oil isn’t king many countries that were king because of oil won’t be anymore. There is a political shift that comes with the massive shift in energy. For example oil not king the saudis are a nobody in that region have basically nothing else to offer. We have much other resources we just need governments that recognize the change.

Fighting for the pipeline out west coast maybe worth it short term but it’s not the future.
It’s unfortunate but I don’t think our population understands this. Reply With Quote
Sep 17, 2020 | 08:39 3
Quote Originally Posted by the big wheel View Post
What’s being missed about alternative energy is that it will improve its efficiency with time. One of the reasons it hasn’t forwarded as much as it should have is that world leaders recognize once oil isn’t king many countries that were king because of oil won’t be anymore. There is a political shift that comes with the massive shift in energy. For example oil not king the saudis are a nobody in that region have basically nothing else to offer. We have much other resources we just need governments that recognize the change.

Fighting for the pipeline out west coast maybe worth it short term but it’s not the future.
It’s unfortunate but I don’t think our population understands this.
How do you think they'll react when their people revolt because the govt promises can't be funded? The world isn't as "progressive" as some would like to think. Largest oil companies in the world are arms of govt. Oil gets banned I say go long war materials, they'll get used. Reply With Quote

  • Sep 17, 2020 | 08:52 4 That’s energy storage (battery bank).
    Energy creation is different and still needed.
    Also lithium mining is hugely destructive and polluting, and a finite resource. But who cares. Reply With Quote

  • Sep 17, 2020 | 09:05 5 Sounds really impressive. A total of 1930 MWh of storage instead of fossil fuel peaker plants running on standby 24/7.

    For perspective that equates to 4 minutes of California electricity usage. So it buys enough time to perhaps spin up the fossil fuel back up plants, instead of having to leave them on all the time? Or enough time to institute the rolling blackouts before the grid collapses?

    Recall a thread about a year ago, where I learned that completely off grid solar powered well sites require 3 MONTHS of battery storage to ensure there is no downtime. California would be somewhat better due to their geographic locatio. But using the 3 months, they only need to build 33,000 storage facilities of this scale to achieve uninterrupted electricity supply in all conditions. Does anyone care to do the math on the availability of the rare earth elements required for that?
    Last edited by AlbertaFarmer5; Sep 17, 2020 at 09:40.
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  • Sep 17, 2020 | 09:08 6 God damn details always get in the way of leftard pipe dreams , lol, as chuck would say Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 09:10 7 Don’t wreck tweeters/WD9 moral superiority moment. Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 09:12 8 The wealth of a country is measured by the productivity of its people, look at Japan in the 70s and 80s post WW2, zero resources but motivated young population, incredible manufacturing and tech. We are going to take everything we have accomplished and pay people to watch netflix and incur debt worldwide to fund it. Zero productivity, maximum debt. Idle hands, leads to civil unrest as currently being seen. We don't need resources to be wealthy but we better have a plan of putting people to work full time or the Riel Rebellion will look like a "social gathering". There's too many gaps in the planning of this Great Reset. Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 09:31 9 Why would people work so hard and so fruitlessly to replace the one thing that has propelled mankind to new heights. Makes no sense.

    Tesla will not work until a few single solar panels on homes works because the grid cannot feed electric vehicles without a major upgrade and its all underground in major cities. And a few solar panels will not work unless you live in Arizona. Chicken chasing egg. Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 10:12 10 The flat earthers seem to always have the bonehead idea that it’s either renewables or fossil fuels. Here is some news in case you missed it, we are going to be using both For the foreseeable future and maybe Alberta can use it’s gas reserves for hydrogen as well.

    Meanwhile “Marxist” Saskatchewan is installing new gas capacity, lots of wind, importing more hydro and maybe using CCS again on a coal plant to meet CO2 reduction commitments.

    And now A5 can tell us In Saskatchewan that none of it will work nor is it needed because we are going to run out of CO2 at some unspecified date in the future! Hahaha Call Saskpower and Scott Moe to stop the insanity!!
    Last edited by chuckChuck; Sep 17, 2020 at 10:33.
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    Sep 17, 2020 | 10:43 11 Chuck, maybe you need to pass on your vital piece of information to Californians then, since they didn’t get the same memo you got. They are legislating 100% decarbonization by 2045.
    Senate Bill (SB) 100 established a landmark policy requiring renewable energy and zero-carbon resources supply 100 percent of electric retail sales to end-use customers by 2045
    So is it them who are the flat earth boneheads, or you for denying their own legislation? Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 10:47 12
    Quote Originally Posted by AlbertaFarmer5 View Post
    Sounds really impressive. A total of 1930 MWh of storage instead of fossil fuel peaker plants running on standby 24/7.

    For perspective that equates to 4 minutes of California electricity usage. So it buys enough time to perhaps spin up the fossil fuel back up plants, instead of having to leave them on all the time? Or enough time to institute the rolling blackouts before the grid collapses?

    Recall a thread about a year ago, where I learned that completely off grid solar powered well sites require 3 MONTHS of battery storage to ensure there is no downtime. California would be somewhat better due to their geographic locatio. But using the 3 months, they only need to build 33,000 storage facilities of this scale to achieve uninterrupted electricity supply in all conditions. Does anyone care to do the math on the availability of the rare earth elements required for that?
    That’s at yesterday’s technology. People thought an electric vehicle was not possible not so long ago. Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 11:01 13
    Quote Originally Posted by the big wheel View Post
    That’s at yesterday’s technology. People thought an electric vehicle was not possible not so long ago.
    Ah, yes so technology has advanced so far since last fall that now we no longer need 3 months of storage because we have banished not only the seasons, but also darkness and clouds. Good to know.
    Actually people have always thought electric vehicles were possible. Back to the 1800's EV's were quite popular. Reply With Quote
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  • Sep 17, 2020 | 11:39 14
    Quote Originally Posted by AlbertaFarmer5 View Post
    Ah, yes so technology has advanced so far since last fall that now we no longer need 3 months of storage because we have banished not only the seasons, but also darkness and clouds. Good to know.
    Actually people have always thought electric vehicles were possible. Back to the 1800's EV's were quite popular.
    Well then why are you not acknowledging what’s happenning? It’s not a question of what you or I think about what’s happenning it’s a question of acknowledging what the world is doing whether we like it or not.
    There’s always been this idea of electric vehicles yes but nearly no one thought it would be here as it is obviously including yourself.
    It’s time to stop crying about the spilled milk and get on with dealing with what the reality is today. Bought off political parties aren’t going to change their view until people start demanding it happen.
    Change is hard to accept sometimes. The longer we resist the farther we re behind. Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 12:02 15
    Quote Originally Posted by AlbertaFarmer5 View Post
    Chuck, maybe you need to pass on your vital piece of information to Californians then, since they didn’t get the same memo you got. They are legislating 100% decarbonization by 2045.

    So is it them who are the flat earth boneheads, or you for denying their own legislation?
    Let them legislate what they want.

    Harper said Canada would stop using fossil fuel sources of energy by 2100.

    Apparently Steve didn't know we were going to need fossil fuels just to keep us from falling short of CO2 in the atmosphere! LOL Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 12:17 16
    Quote Originally Posted by the big wheel View Post
    Change is hard to accept sometimes. The longer we resist the farther we re behind.
    I bet the people of cali and Ont wished they had resisted, they are so far ahead of us now, in unrepayable debt that is. And there green scams just forestalled the process of putting in real reliable energy now, so it will be rolling blackouts and brown outs and expensive bills until someone gets a clue.

    I am not blindly supporting any untested and risky technology just because CNN told me to.
    Last edited by jazz; Sep 17, 2020 at 12:19.
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  • Sep 17, 2020 | 12:51 17 blindly follow the sheep, do not question mein fuhrer
    wear a parachute , though Reply With Quote
    Sep 17, 2020 | 15:30 18 Funny, there’s been a pumped storage project proposed here for years that would do much the same except it would use the nuclear energy we pay the Americans to take at night and store it to replace much more expensive energy we buy in the day. The province seems to be happy with the idea but the feds are dragging their asses Reply With Quote
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  • Sep 18, 2020 | 07:12 19
    Quote Originally Posted by jazz View Post
    I bet the people of cali and Ont wished they had resisted, they are so far ahead of us now, in unrepayable debt that is. And there green scams just forestalled the process of putting in real reliable energy now, so it will be rolling blackouts and brown outs and expensive bills until someone gets a clue.

    I am not blindly supporting any untested and risky technology just because CNN told me to.
    Yeah but you support an incompetent moron for President so your judgement is crap! LOL

    And you must think Saskatchewan is bad too with its plan to have 50% renewables by 2030! Scott Moe and Sask Power just more green scammers! LOL Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 07:21 20
    Quote Originally Posted by jazz View Post
    Why would people work so hard and so fruitlessly to replace the one thing that has propelled mankind to new heights. Makes no sense.

    Tesla will not work until a few single solar panels on homes works because the grid cannot feed electric vehicles without a major upgrade and its all underground in major cities. And a few solar panels will not work unless you live in Arizona. Chicken chasing egg.
    The experts have spoken. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 07:27 21
    Quote Originally Posted by tweety View Post
    The experts have spoken.
    You do know that I worked 10ys in the energy industry right, 5 of those were in the energy optimization dept of a major utility with a large footprint in NA.

    We looked at every energy scheme we could and 99% of them got tossed out on economics.

    So yeah, I know what I am talking about. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 07:28 22
    Quote Originally Posted by chuckChuck View Post
    Yeah but you support an incompetent moron for President so your judgement is crap! LOL
    Thats high praise coming from someone who worked for a organization actively trying to impoverish farmers for decades in the name of socialism. Some judgement there. Naomi Klein a friend of yours? Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 07:32 23
    Quote Originally Posted by jazz View Post
    You do know that I worked 10ys in the energy industry right, 5 of those were in the energy optimization dept of a major utility with a large footprint in NA.

    We looked at every energy scheme we could and 99% of them got tossed out on economics.

    So yeah, I know what I am talking about.
    Yes, you also think Trump is a genius. Hopefully you're better at farming then energy and politics. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 07:37 24
    Quote Originally Posted by jazz View Post
    You do know that I worked 10ys in the energy industry right, 5 of those were in the energy optimization dept of a major utility with a large footprint in NA.

    We looked at every energy scheme we could and 99% of them got tossed out on economics.

    So yeah, I know what I am talking about.
    So that was how long ago? 10,20,30 years? And technology and costs haven't changed since then? LOL

    And how do you explain the change to more renewables in SK, ND, Great Britain, Australia, California, Germany, Denmark.........., the list is long.

    The Australian operator we discussed a few weeks ago already said wind and solar are the cheapest generation sources now. She is on the ground making decisions based on current facts not based on outdated information. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 07:44 25
    Quote Originally Posted by chuckChuck View Post
    So that was how long ago? 10,20,30 years?
    What field is your engineering degree in chuck? LMAO Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 08:00 26
    Quote Originally Posted by tweety View Post
    Yes, you also think Trump is a genius. Hopefully you're better at farming then energy and politics.
    Tesla will ride a stock wave of misplaced enthusiasm and then be bought off and broken up by the majors.

    Its overpriced cars and bogus solar schemes are just fodder for the green crowd. None of it is anywhere near to mainstream adoption.

    But by all means keep hoping if that makes you feel better.

    The world will still be powered by FF for at least the next decade until some nuke plants can get built. But since none have been permitted make that 25yrs. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 08:15 27
    Quote Originally Posted by jazz View Post
    What field is your engineering degree in chuck? LMAO
    Wheat field.....duh. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 08:29 28
    Quote Originally Posted by the big wheel View Post
    Wheat field.....duh.
    Far, far, far left field. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 08:32 29
    Quote Originally Posted by tweety View Post
    The experts have spoken.
    What is with all the plurals? Chuck refers to himself in the nomative plural of I. Tweety apparently thinks Jazz is a team. Reply With Quote
    Sep 18, 2020 | 08:43 30 Did anyone actually read the articles on this?
    From what I could find, the smaller 730 MWh plant covers 4.5 acres.
    Lifespan of 20 years. So, that is promising, battery technology must have progressed, because I don't know anyone with a 20 year old cordless tool, or cellphone still functioning on the original battery.
    No cost estimate anywhere I could find. Reply With Quote