railroad through the rockies

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railroad through the rockies

Feb 9, 2019 | 16:31 1 How feasible would it be to do some tunneling through the rockies to make our exporting of commodities more efficient and railroading saver. The Trudeau government had no trouble blowing 4,5 billion dollars on a wore out pipeline.
How much could we improve our export capabilities to inject that kind of cash in such infrastructure, not saying it should be just one tunnel but a series of a few to get rid of bottleneck and avalanche areas. Reply With Quote
Feb 9, 2019 | 16:41 2 If memory serves me correctly it seems Europeans do this fairly often. .....and of course there is the chunnel under water and look what Norway is planning.... Reply With Quote
farmaholic's Avatar Feb 9, 2019 | 16:50 3 Why would "nationalizing" the Railroads be considered a communist socialist endeavor? Under the circumstances I would call it nation building....they don't want to seem to invest in capacity expansion. What would be wrong with a percentage of "surge" capacity? Reply With Quote
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  • Feb 9, 2019 | 17:05 4 It could be run on a toll fee. I think this could be a nation building process there are all kinds of government, private sector projects this could be a win for everybody. Reply With Quote
    Feb 9, 2019 | 17:06 5 THE WORLD'S LONGEST RAIL TUNNEL IN THE HEART OF THE SWISS ALPS
    Length: 57km (the longest rail tunnel in the world)

    Duration of tunnel journey: a little under 20 minutes

    Total length of all the tunnels: 152km (94 miles)

    Highest point of the tunnel: 550m (1,800 feet) above sea level

    Maximum rock cover: 2,300m (7,545 metres)

    Construction time (excluding exploratory work): 17 years (100 feet per day)

    Excavated material: 28.2 million tonnes

    Total cost: 12.2billion Swiss francs (£8.4billion) $12 billion dollars

    Tunnel capacity: 260 freight trains and 65 passenger trains per day

    Timetabled speed: freight trains 100km/h (62mph); passenger trains up to 200 km/h (125mph)

    Maximum speed: freight trains 160km/h (100mph); passenger trains 250 km/h (155mph)

    Reduction in journey time from Zurich to Lugano after completion

    of the axis (from 2020): around 45 minutes

    Official opening of the Gotthard Base Tunnel: 11 December 2016 Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 09:10 6
    Quote Originally Posted by farmaholic View Post
    Why would "nationalizing" the Railroads be considered a communist socialist endeavor? Under the circumstances I would call it nation building....they don't want to seem to invest in capacity expansion. What would be wrong with a percentage of "surge" capacity?
    You really don't want a country as retarded as this one to own a rail line. Look how long it took to get the line to Churchill fixed? Rail maintenance is ongoing cost, let alone expansion. And government doesn't know **** all about running a business. Your neighbor looks like he is ****ing up as a farmer, go buy him out, no matter the cost - surely you can run his operation better than him. That is essentially what you are telling government.

    Socialists have no ****ing clue when cuts have to be made and costs saved to make a business of value, regardless of how someone else feels. Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 09:13 7
    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    You really don't want a country as retarded as this one to own a rail line. Look how long it took to get the line to Churchill fixed? Rail maintenance is ongoing cost, let alone expansion. And government doesn't know **** all about running a business. Your neighbor looks like he is ****ing up as a farmer, go buy him out, no matter the cost - surely you can run his operation better than him. That is essentially what you are telling government.

    Socialists have no ****ing clue when cuts have to be made and costs saved to make a business of value, regardless of how someone else feels.
    The churchill line didn't get fixed because Omnitrax was paying their shareholders instead of using the government money to fix and maintain the line....which is why the government threatened to sue... Reply With Quote
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  • SASKFARMER3's Avatar Feb 10, 2019 | 09:19 8 See that would take brains and planning for a greater canada and eastern canada just wouldn’t have it. Reply With Quote
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  • farmaholic's Avatar Feb 10, 2019 | 09:23 9
    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    You really don't want a country as retarded as this one to own a rail line. Look how long it took to get the line to Churchill fixed? Rail maintenance is ongoing cost, let alone expansion. And government doesn't know **** all about running a business. Your neighbor looks like he is ****ing up as a farmer, go buy him out, no matter the cost - surely you can run his operation better than him. That is essentially what you are telling government.

    Socialists have no ****ing clue when cuts have to be made and costs saved to make a business of value, regardless of how someone else feels.
    I don't think "governments" are good at business either but how do you force a capitalistic duopoly to do what's best for the country they serve rather than the shareholders they serve.

    Equally as incompetent as a government run business who doesn't know when to make necessary cost saving cuts is a capitalistic run business who doesn't know when to make profit increasing investments or expansions. Reply With Quote
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  • Feb 10, 2019 | 09:33 10
    Quote Originally Posted by farmaholic View Post
    I don't think "governments" are good at business either but how do you force a capitalistic duopoly to do what's best for the country they serve rather than the shareholders they serve.

    Equally as incompetent as a government run business who doesn't know when to make necessary cost saving cuts is a capitalistic run business who doesn't know when to make profit increasing investments or expansions.
    You say profit as if it is a guarantee. Cutting costs alway guarantees savings.

    Go invest in 3 new Case Quadtracks. My numbers say it will be profitable expansion for you. If I am wrong, oh well, silly me - good luck with the bankruptcy. Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 09:45 11
    Quote Originally Posted by bucket View Post
    The churchill line didn't get fixed because Omnitrax was paying their shareholders instead of using the government money to fix and maintain the line....which is why the government threatened to sue...
    Government was saddled with regulation. Even if they owned it, there would be stupid shit like environmental or cultural considerations to be made. Government could have went in overnight and started fixing it regardless of Omnitrax, and working to take it away from them behind the scenes. Rather than taking year and half. They lacked the moral will to get it done regardless of the consequences. Spineless. You want them running the main lines? Holy ****. Soon as the rail breaks in Indian territory they will have to have 6 months of spirit dances and consultations to see if it merits repairing. Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 10:18 12 Why do you guys keep bringing up twinning the tracks through the mountains?, never going to happen. In today's climate of environmental challenges, gender impact studies, native impact studies, study this study that it can never be built. The government bought an expansion ready approved pipeline project for christ sakes, and it won't get built. We need to work to find viable solutions to improve the rail system as it is now, because there is no way in hell a second track is going through the mountains. Reply With Quote
    farmaholic's Avatar Feb 10, 2019 | 10:44 13
    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    You say profit as if it is a guarantee. Cutting costs alway guarantees savings.

    Go invest in 3 new Case Quadtracks. My numbers say it will be profitable expansion for you. If I am wrong, oh well, silly me - good luck with the bankruptcy.
    I didn't say there was a guarantee. But if there is a need and nothing is done how is the lack of action any smarter?

    In a way railroads are a national interest. Reply With Quote
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  • Feb 10, 2019 | 10:53 14
    Quote Originally Posted by farmaholic View Post
    I didn't say there was a guarantee. But if there is a need and nothing is done how is the lack of action any smarter?

    In a way railroads are a national interest.
    as should an affordable stable fuel supply(especially in a country this big), a stable affordable medical system and a stable affordable food supply Reply With Quote
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  • farmaholic's Avatar Feb 10, 2019 | 11:10 15
    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    You say profit as if it is a guarantee. Cutting costs alway guarantees savings.

    Go invest in 3 new Case Quadtracks. My numbers say it will be profitable expansion for you. If I am wrong, oh well, silly me - good luck with the bankruptcy.
    And I bet there are many examples of how "cost cutting" measures bit asses!
    Last edited by farmaholic; Feb 10, 2019 at 11:20.
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    Feb 10, 2019 | 11:42 16
    Quote Originally Posted by Misterjade9 View Post
    Why do you guys keep bringing up twinning the tracks through the mountains?, never going to happen. In today's climate of environmental challenges, gender impact studies, native impact studies, study this study that it can never be built. The government bought an expansion ready approved pipeline project for christ sakes, and it won't get built. We need to work to find viable solutions to improve the rail system as it is now, because there is no way in hell a second track is going through the mountains.
    We re going to have a conservative majority government. Just like last time we had one nothing like this will be done even though they have the full power to do so. Making us feel all warm and fuzzy and smart we voted conservative and not liberal Just like the pipelines. But at least now we’re paying a former premier to advise lawyers how to deal with not getting the pipelines built. So maybe we should pay one to advise how not to get his done also. Seems logical to me. Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 11:55 17 First . Thanks to brain mulroney and the Free trade agreement.
    You can not nationalise them without compensation for their
    Potential future profits ,they would have realized.

    So without even the threat of nationalization in the
    Govt.s tool box.
    The RR s have all the cards.

    Part of the globalisation of power to the corporations.

    Just one of the many examples why Harpers and mulroney and scheers . Are bad news for farmers and everyone else.

    There is no competetive free enterprise market
    Created when you
    Give your country's sovernty over to the seed,chemical,and Rail road Corporations.

    You will soon not even own a seed.
    What is next?

    Sorry but an incompetent corrupt liberal ,
    Does less damage than that. Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 12:07 18
    Quote Originally Posted by sawfly1 View Post
    Does less damage than that.
    Sad but true. It is a sad state of affairs when the best we can hope for from our governments is to do the least amount of damage possible, after having accepted that they are not capable of doing anything beneficial, just choose the lesser of the evils. Reply With Quote
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  • Feb 10, 2019 | 14:12 19
    Quote Originally Posted by farmaholic View Post
    I didn't say there was a guarantee. But if there is a need and nothing is done how is the lack of action any smarter?

    In a way railroads are a national interest.
    Smart for investors and company profitability. Existing assets are used at full production and expenses are easily covered by revenue. Rather than complain I would load up on stock. Might make better return on it than farming. I don't think any private company should be subject to the whims of the general public in making business decisions. Reply With Quote
    farmaholic's Avatar Feb 10, 2019 | 14:29 20
    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    Smart for investors and company profitability. Existing assets are used at full production and expenses are easily covered by revenue.
    Can't argue with that statement

    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    Rather than complain I would load up on stock. Might make better return on it than farming.
    Hardly, I doubt it.

    Quote Originally Posted by 15444 View Post
    I don't think any private company should be subject to the whims of the general public in making business decisions.
    So then it would be ok for the RR's to scale back service to the point it harms the Canadian economy?
    Government is the people for the people(Haha haha) and not even government can legislate levels of service or have expectations of service?


    Railroads are a vital service, they're not a ****en doughnut shop!
    Last edited by farmaholic; Feb 10, 2019 at 14:31.
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  • Feb 10, 2019 | 17:21 21
    Quote Originally Posted by Misterjade9 View Post
    Why do you guys keep bringing up twinning the tracks through the mountains?, never going to happen. In today's climate of environmental challenges, gender impact studies, native impact studies, study this study that it can never be built. The government bought an expansion ready approved pipeline project for christ sakes, and it won't get built. We need to work to find viable solutions to improve the rail system as it is now, because there is no way in hell a second track is going through the mountains.
    The rail lines between Kamloops and Hope BC are twinned and operated as directional traffic [... both CP and CN trains travel together on the same directional track.. one track used to travel in each direction] through the Fraser Valley [about 1/2 of the distance].

    CP has the eastern Rocky Mountain Rodgers Pass [ Yellowhead Pass for CN makes the other eastern lower grade of the passes]... The CP Rodgers Pass is the very difficult high 'grade' railroad to take freight through.

    Another future option could be the Howse Pass.
    "Howse Pass is lower than many other passes in this range and it was considered for the Canadian Pacific's route, but Kicking Horse Pass was chosen instead. There has been some talk of building a road through the pass from Saskatchewan River Crossing to Golden, British Columbia' Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 19:29 22
    Quote Originally Posted by farmaholic View Post



    So then it would be ok for the RR's to scale back service to the point it harms the Canadian economy?
    Government is the people for the people(Haha haha) and not even government can legislate levels of service or have expectations of service?


    Railroads are a vital service, they're not a ****en doughnut shop!

    RR's aren't going to scale back movement as it directly correlates with revenue. But, they may very well decide to move more product type (oil) for whatever reason over another (grain). I have no problem with that, it is a business decision, likely done to increase profits. But it doesn't benefit the grain farmer so they decide government should step in and dictate how the business is run? This true blue Conservative doesn't support that. But it is these discussions that show how much Red is in a Tory, and there are a lot of them.

    The real problem is that government has their hands in ****ing up the enterprise of building pipelines to transport oil in the country, which has led to the predicament for the grain farmer. So blame government, don't blame railroads. Government meddling ****ed up pipelines and if you push them to meddle in railroads, they will **** that up too. Reply With Quote
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  • helmsdale's Avatar Feb 10, 2019 | 19:43 23
    Quote Originally Posted by TOM4CWB View Post
    The rail lines between Kamloops and Hope BC are twinned and operated as directional traffic [... both CP and CN trains travel together on the same directional track.. one track used to travel in each direction] through the Fraser Valley [about 1/2 of the distance].

    CP has the eastern Rocky Mountain Rodgers Pass [ Yellowhead Pass for CN makes the other eastern lower grade of the passes]... The CP Rodgers Pass is the very difficult high 'grade' railroad to take freight through.

    Another future option could be the Howse Pass.
    "Howse Pass is lower than many other passes in this range and it was considered for the Canadian Pacific's route, but Kicking Horse Pass was chosen instead. There has been some talk of building a road through the pass from Saskatchewan River Crossing to Golden, British Columbia'
    Still bottlenecks through rogers...

    There are only really two passes. CP through Rogers, and CN through Yellowhead. Even CP's Crowsnest only gets across the divide and then still has to punch up to golden and run through the Rogers.

    And even then there is only ONE route to vancouver, unless we're counting Prince Rupert, be it down the fraser river canyon. CN still lists the rail line from Prince George to West/North Vancouver on its map line, but in all my travels out there I did not see a single grain train traversing that track.

    There are 4 potential routes to vancouver:
    1) Allison Pass: never even been an attempt at rail traffic as far as im aware. Even the old Kettle Valley rail Line cut from Princeton, BC to the NW, and merged up with pass #2, or continued through from Merrit to Spences Bridge to pass #3
    2) Coquiholla Pass: Kamloops to Hope BC. Abandoned long ago. It was a nightmare.
    3) Fraser Canyon: preferred current route.
    4) Ran the Fraser River Canyon from Prince George basically to Lillooet BC, and then wandered off through Whistler, Squamish, and came into West van/North Van. Like I said, Im pretty sure that line doesn't see any grain trains.

    Aside from resurrecting 1,2, or 4 with serious infrastructure builds, I dont see how we benefit much from increased passes over the divide since it all bottlenecks down to the Fraser Canyon. Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 20:05 24 Going west is ugly! Going North is ugly Going east is even uglier because it feels like a foreign country.
    The most reasonably is south and a good reason to just become a State! Reply With Quote
    Feb 10, 2019 | 21:22 25 It it was a fast, easy efficient transportation corridor, then Usa freight could displace Canadian,

    Sorry for that, but would likely still happen Reply With Quote