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Jul 8, 2018 | 09:29 1 Data suggests the occasional yield gain with a decrease in quality in Durum. Mornings are dewy but ground in dry. Last weekend was supposed to be cool and wet so half the acres got Prosaro XTR. The rest I shut fungicide program down and will let nature take it to dry. Will be nice not to have the wheel tracks come straightcut time. Ill let you guys take the risk of preharvest herbi and shitty colour I just let'er stand.

Canola oh natural to straight cut time. Hope there is enough moisture to fill the pods so it can yield 40 and be break even.

Lentils half sprayed with fungi as well. The fungis will keep it green for longer but with limited moisture not interested in having them run out in early podding.

Midge in durum is well below threshold of 1 per 10 heads for quality or 1 per 4 for yield. Its more like 1 per 500 heads.

Lentils have 0 aphids so far.

Sprayer gets a rest and I get to take care of some projects.
Last edited by biglentil; Jul 8, 2018 at 09:31.
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Jul 8, 2018 | 09:58 2 I am spraying all my wheat all at heading time in a attempt to lessen the affects of fusarium.

I did not spray my barley because it was headed before all this wet weather started so now hoping it will be ok.

Canola I won' be spraying because in the past we have never had much of a problem with sclerotinia and I think it is really hard to get a pay back.
Last edited by seldomseen; Jul 8, 2018 at 10:03.
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farmaholic's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 09:59 3 The ground surface in the heavy wheat canopy is moist here. Mushrooms found in canola, but couldn't "find" the schlerotinia type....but that isn't saying they aren't there. Some old cereal residue is harboring the orange fusarium mold.

Open airy canopies here are drier than closed heavy ones. Fusarium can be airborne. This year I am not taking any chances..... marketing fusarium infected grain is not fun...but there are no guarantees of "control" anyway with the cereal fungicides...suppression only! I think the cost is too high for what it does. Chemistry can't overcome the power of Mother Nature.

Maybe the fungi apps will help with leaf diseases as well.

Biglentil.... I don't know if I would risk not spraying that susceptible shit durum! Although you might be too late by now anyway.... small window of application. I've had a durum crop completely decimated by fusarium, I believe it was 2014...."commercial salvage"...and it was shit too. I stopped twice to make sure the elevator door on the combine wasn't open or that I was chucking it all out the back.... it just wasn't there! Then 2016 was also bad but not near as bad as 2014, great volume but it was infected. If it isn't "desert" dry....I think there could be problems in durum. I don't want to grow it because my crystal ball can't see what the growing season will be like and my experience growing it in moist conditions isn't good. Aren't most durum varieties developed from desert durum? Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 10:05 4 Wasn’t much for fungicide use around here till 10 or 12 years ago. Now most large guys are 100% on their cereals. Smaller guys not as much. Being on the west side of sask it’s a bit more arid than the east side so disease pressure is not as constant a threat. Find now the attitude is guys are farming so many acres fungicide applications are like putting on fertilizer. It’s just done. Nothing wrong with it but I was under the impression unless it was soft white wheat you scouted for disease and sprayed accordingly. Much like therapeutic use of antibiotics in livestock overuse of fungicide isn’t any better? Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 10:29 5 On the same topic, I have a question about timing. I get the impression that our growing conditions are unique, with cold nights and lots of moisture. Right now, wheat has many heads fully emerged, while multiple new tillers are still just getting started on the same plants ( seeded at 3 Bushels per acre). Same with canola, even at 5lbs and good emergence, our window for flowering is usually 2 months( and contrary to the literature, all but the last flowers which inevitably freeze are significant contributors to yield here). given the short period of time that the fungicides are effective, and the short window of application, how and when could I apply fungicide to be effective? Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 10:49 6 In two previous bad fusarium years 16 and 14 I think it was. I could not of timed my fungi application any better and my checks showed no difference in Fusarium. Maybe other guys have seen a response. Days are hot, sunny and windy and crop looks very healthy. Just like antibiotics in children fungicides too can F'up immunity.

Maybe without any fungicide or preharvest herb we will actually have the beneficial fungus necessary to break the trash down. Instead of still battling with three year old durum trash at seeding time. Remember there are beneficial bugs not just predatory, bacteria and fungus. There is more to it than any of us will ever understand. Hell birds chirping are said to open the stomata on the underside of leaves in the morning for example.
Last edited by biglentil; Jul 8, 2018 at 10:52.
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farmaholic's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 10:50 7 Last year we never used a drop.

Wheat timing...concentrate on the main stems.

Canola early flowering so early season infection doesn't rob as much yeild as late season infection.

Above all....Mother Nature deals herself the last card off a stacked deck. Our success is dependent upon the "Grace" of Mother Nature! Reply With Quote
Klause's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 10:59 8 All of you that keep spraying so many fungicides... Look at your soil under an electronic microscope before and a few days after.

The amount of beneficial soil bugs you are killing is mind numbing

There's beneficial that prey on the bad fungi... Plus sask didn't have a fusarium problem till heavy use of fungicide began.



I wish more farmers took unbiased soil biology education there would be a lot less money wssted.


Spray plane going in drizzle herfe this morning. Reply With Quote
farmaholic's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 11:00 9 Biglentil...last year nothing could have rotted(crop residue) here! Everything was a fucking fire hazard!

Oh but I agree...there is a huge picture here...very panoramic!

Funny thing is...we can spray all the pesticides we want...we still have all the pests we're "trying" to eradicate....so I would bet there's lots of beneficial left too! In saying that, I'm not condoning careless over-use of pesticides.

I think you're on the right track with the "best management practices" thinking.

Only time will tell and time won't lie! Reply With Quote
farmaholic's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 11:08 10 I believe the proliferation of crop disease is every bit as much if not way more a result of continuous cropping and environmental conditions than that of the advent of the use of fungicides.

But WTF does this uneducated Sandbox Farmer know? Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 11:28 11 Fungi are living evolving organisms too. You just make them stronger by exposing them to chemicals. And their populations turn over in mere days vs weeds that need an entire year cycle to evolve. Just creating a larger problem down the line.

Rotations are too tight - someday, we will all have a part of land into forages or something to break these cycles because chemistry eventually wont do it. Reply With Quote
Partners's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 11:29 12
Quote Originally Posted by Klause View Post
All of you that keep spraying so many fungicides... Look at your soil under an electronic microscope before and a few days after.

The amount of beneficial soil bugs you are killing is mind numbing

There's beneficial that prey on the bad fungi... Plus sask didn't have a fusarium problem till heavy use of fungicide began.



I wish more farmers took unbiased soil biology education there would be a lot less money wssted.


Spray plane going in drizzle herfe this morning.
Good one..LIKE.LIKE.. Reply With Quote
Klause's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 11:30 13
Quote Originally Posted by farmaholic View Post
I believe the proliferation of crop disease is every bit as much if not way more a result of continuous cropping and environmental conditions than that of the advent of the use of fungicides.

But WTF does this uneducated Sandbox Farmer know?


Except it's prevalence is far greater here.


We farm with a focus on yield above all else.

It is going to be the one of us because it's tuning the soil into a dead medium.


An acre of healthy soil has 620ish tonnes of microbes and insects in it.

They have done plant health studies on "farmed" soil and found that number to be diminished to 40-50 Mt.


There's a book... Nature and properties of soil.... Everyone should be required to read it. Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 12:20 14 Crop rotation is your best defence and that doesn't mean wheat-canola year after year. Direct seeding is great when its dry but year after year of trash laying on top the soil is great for hot bed for fungus. Reply With Quote
Klause's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 12:23 15 Microbial and enzymatic activity of soil contaminated with azoxystrobin


The use of fungicides in crop protection still effectively eliminates fungal pathogens of plants. However, fungicides may dissipate to various elements of the environment and cause irreversible changes. Considering this problem, the aim of the presented study was to evaluate changes in soil biological activity in response to contamination with azoxystrobin. The study was carried out in the laboratory on samples of sandy loam with a pH of 7.0 in 1 Mol KCl dm−3. Soil samples were treated with azoxystrobin in one of four doses: 0.075 (dose recommended by the manufacturer), 2.250, 11.25 and 22.50 mg kg−1 soil DM (dry matter of soil). The control soil sample did not contain fungicide. Bacteria were identified based on 16S rRNA gene sequencing, and fungi were identified by internal transcribed spacer (ITS) region sequencing. The study revealed that increased doses of azoxystrobin inhibited the growth of organotrophic bacteria, actinomycetes and fungi. The fungicide also caused changes in microbial biodiversity. The lowest values of the colony development (CD) index were recorded for fungi and the ecophysiological (EP) index for organotrophic bacteria. Azoxystrobin had an inhibitory effect on the activity of dehydrogenases, catalase, urease, acid phosphatase and alkaline phosphatase. Dehydrogenases were found to be most resistant to the effects of the fungicide, while alkaline phosphatase in the soil recovered the balance in the shortest time. Four species of bacteria from the genus Bacillus and two species of fungi from the genus Aphanoascus were isolated from the soil contaminated with the highest dose of azoxystrobin (22.50 mg kg−1).

Keywords: Azoxystrobin, Microorganisms, Biodiversity, Enzymes, Resistance, Identification of microorganisms
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Introduction
Pesticides are chemicals which play a major role in maintaining adequate quality of agricultural products by controlling plant pathogens. In addition, they are used in human and animal hygiene, in the protection of feed, food, natural raw materials and products made of them (Chatterjee et al. 2013). Primarily, the use of pesticides is aimed at controlling target organisms. Despite this fact, it is not possible to predict the environmental fate of pesticides. The widespread use, toxicity, mobility and persistence of pesticides may lead to their dissipation to all elements of the natural environment. Thus, the excessive use of pesticides is still a major problem affecting the quality of the natural environment, which is why more and more studies are being conducted to determine their effects on living organisms (Seiber and Kleinschmidt 2011; Wyszkowska and Kucharski 2004). The highest quantities of pesticides are accumulated in soil, which may cause changes in the terrestrial environment, often manifested by decreasing soil fertility. Studies on the presence of pesticides in soil and their impact on soil organisms are necessary because soil is most affected by contamination. Microbial activity of soil is used to assess the potential changes caused by these chemicals. Microbial response to contaminants dissipating to soil is prompt and thus can provide necessary information on environmental changes (Zhang et al. 2006). Due to the fact that plant protection products are potentially harmful to non-target organisms, there has been considerable interest in determining their impact on soil microorganisms and processes (Bending et al. 2007).

Azoxystrobin (methyl(E)-2-{2-[6-(2-cyanophenoxy)pyrimidin-4-yloxy]phenyl}-3-methoxyacrylate), a strobilurin-derived fungicide, is one of the most popular chemicals used for the control of fungal plant pathogens. It has a broad spectrum of systemic activity against pathogens by inhibiting mitochondrial respiration in the process of binding with cytochrome b complexes. The binding process blocks electron transport from cytochrome b to c, thus inhibiting the generation of energy through the oxidative phosphorylation necessary for cell growth, and finally causes the death of the pathogen (Bartlett et al. 2002). In the natural environment, azoxystrobin is degraded to azoxystrobin acid, which is much more water-soluble and prone to leaching in soils than its parent compound (Ghosh and Singh 2009). Rodrigues et al. (2013) reported that the half-life of azoxystrobin can range from 14 days to 6 months, depending on the microbiological and biochemical soil parameters. Microbial degradation of azoxystrobin is associated with the hydrolysis of the carboxylic ester bond in the parent compound (Katagi 2006). Therefore, microorganisms and enzymes have a significant role in the degradation of this active substance (Clinton et al. 2011).

The literature (Guo et al. 2015) provides limited information on the impact of azoxystrobin on microbial and biochemical activity in different types of soil. Considering this fact, the aim of our study was to determine the effect of azoxystrobin on the soil ecosystem by determining microbial counts, their biodiversity, enzymatic activity of soil, soil resistance and the soil resilience index. In the study, new microbial strains resistant to azoxystrobin were isolated.

Conclusions
Azoxystrobin has a harmful effect on soil microorganisms and their biodiversity, as well as enzymatic activity and resistance of soil. The microbial and biochemical soil indices identified in the study provided necessary information about soil quality and fertility. The calculated predicted environmental concentration (PEC) of azoxystrobin in soil confirms the fact that the use of this fungicide in contaminating doses creates a risk to living organisms. These findings suggest that azoxystrobin designed for the control of fungal diseases in crops and vegetables should be used carefully and according to the manufacturer’s recommendations. Its use in increased doses distorts the homeostasis of soil determined based on the activity of soil microorganisms, which can have a strong impact on plant growth and yield. Bacterial and fungal strains isolated from soil show the adaptability to contamination of soil with azoxystrobin but also with other strobilurin-derived substances. Because of their degrading potential, these microorganisms can be considered when developing strategies for the bioremediation of soils contaminated with pesticides.
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Jul 8, 2018 | 12:53 16 There's beneficial that prey on the bad fungi... Plus sask didn't have a fusarium problem till heavy use of fungicide began.




Sask did not have a fusarium problem until it started raining more and everyone stopped working there straw down.
There was lots of fusarium here in 1993 after a terrible wet summer and I don't think there was any fungicides sprayed around here at that time.
It wasn't that long ago that Sask was 50% crop and 50% fallow. Most farm seeded into black dirt and there wasn't much crop disease.
No one had fusarium until the No Till Drill was invented so it must be the No Till Drill that caused the epidemic.
Last edited by seldomseen; Jul 8, 2018 at 12:58.
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Jul 8, 2018 | 13:29 17
Quote Originally Posted by Klause View Post
All of you that keep spraying so many fungicides... Look at your soil under an electronic microscope before and a few days after.

The amount of beneficial soil bugs you are killing is mind numbing

There's beneficial that prey on the bad fungi... Plus sask didn't have a fusarium problem till heavy use of fungicide began.



I wish more farmers took unbiased soil biology education there would be a lot less money wssted.


Spray plane going in drizzle herfe this morning.
🎯 agree 100% Reply With Quote
Klause's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 13:50 18
Quote Originally Posted by seldomseen View Post
There's beneficial that prey on the bad fungi... Plus sask didn't have a fusarium problem till heavy use of fungicide began.




Sask did not have a fusarium problem until it started raining more and everyone stopped working there straw down.
There was lots of fusarium here in 1993 after a terrible wet summer and I don't think there was any fungicides sprayed around here at that time.
It wasn't that long ago that Sask was 50% crop and 50% fallow. Most farm seeded into black dirt and there wasn't much crop disease.
No one had fusarium until the No Till Drill was invented so it must be the No Till Drill that caused the epidemic.

Fusarium has been documented back to ancient Egypt.

Fusarium is also a catch-all for a bunch of similar diseases.

Humans fan and do get fusarium infections also. Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 14:55 19 All i know is that the guys that dont use fungicide will cut their canola a week
To 10 days earlier than the ones that do . That has to translate into quite a yield increase . Oil goes in last and that is the bushel weight . Their probably is better alternatives but we need something Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 15:29 20 Thankfully our business is still free enough we can do what we want. If we didn't spray fungicides here fusarium would make our wheat unsaleable in a year like this (warm and moist).

Re direct seeding, residue and fungus, the Red River Valley is plagued with fusarium as well and for years residue was burned and tillage is extensive. Innoculum is everywhere. Conditions in MB with warm and humidity promote fungal growth. Reply With Quote
SASKFARMER3's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 19:02 21 Peas recovered a bit and look way better. Never ever will use viper.



Canola last year did the test and only applied on a section and some full sections half the field. Yea they drag on a bit longer but last year no measurable yield difference. This year more tests but I’m thinking no difference.



Last the HRS we will probably do half acres since a lot is past point and it’s been very little dew since Wednesday last week.

I’ll have results at harvest and grade.




Last year 100% hrs and peas and barley canola just a bit. Similar yield to neighbours some was higher but seeded later. Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 19:16 22 Your peas look super and quite a change from your earlier pics so I would wonder about root rot. Any time my peas had the stems pinched off they never recovered but that might be because it never dried up. Reply With Quote
farmaholic's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 19:41 23 SF3, so are you saying you sprayed everything last year but won't spray everything this year? Are you overall drier this year than last year?

I will base my decision to spray on our conditions on our farm. This is definitely a different year than last year for us....as I explained earlier.

I have some dirt that sees wheat just about every second year. I have land that had epidemic fusarium infections on them. Rolly land with moist rich low spots. We were NEVER regular fungicide users in the past either...in fact I balked it! Until you get a durum crop decimated by fusarium, a canola crop that "ripens" prematurely and lodges because of sclerotinia stem rot. A lentil crop that has sclerotia bodies growing in white cotton like structures on their stems! And in some cases conditions that not even fungicides can overcome....even if applied twice, like they sometimes suggest!

Continuous cropping
Zero Till
High moisture environment
Pathogens
Hosts

No doubt the current farming methods have exasperated/exacerbate the potential problem.

If the market wouldn't punish us for a minute amount of fusarium in cereals...maybe I would fore go an application too. Mother Nature can take enough, then the market kicks you in the nuts too...
Last edited by farmaholic; Jul 8, 2018 at 22:37.
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SASKFARMER3's Avatar Jul 8, 2018 | 21:54 24 We are way dryer than last year. Very little to no dew last week.

We’re just right like before the floods.

Last year all wheat barley and peas sprayed plus some canola.

I think we’re back to normal weather. Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 22:25 25
Quote Originally Posted by caseih View Post
All i know is that the guys that dont use fungicide will cut their canola a week
To 10 days earlier than the ones that do . That has to translate into quite a yield increase . Oil goes in last and that is the bushel weight . Their probably is better alternatives but we need something
That’s what Klause is getting at .
Current methods pushed by chem companies are not helping the cause like you think . Band aids for issues happening in the soil because of their products. That’s the point Reply With Quote
Jul 8, 2018 | 22:27 26 No different than a drug addiction, without it crops crash . Unless we start looking at what we , they , are doing to the soil . Reply With Quote
SASKFARMER3's Avatar Jul 9, 2018 | 05:14 27 I'm agreeing with furrow and Klause on this one. It has something to do with soil and no-till and moisture. Worked fields in fall outyielding just about everything around. Reply With Quote
farmaholic's Avatar Jul 9, 2018 | 06:30 28 What ever happened to the theory anhydrous ammonia would turn your land into an airport runway? People still use it and grow crops....look at the pics SF3 posts.

Dead soils? Summerfallow did alot of damage! Reply With Quote
SASKFARMER3's Avatar Jul 9, 2018 | 07:32 29 Again funny just checking wheat it’s 7:30 and basically all dew will be gone in half hour it’s 18 above zero wind Reply With Quote
Jul 9, 2018 | 07:58 30 When you work ground that has been no till you will release extra nitrogen that could be part of the reason for yield increase. I think tillage can help cut down on disease too, bury Sclerotinia bodies deeper where they cannot germinate as easy.

We have been using fungicides for almost about 20 years. Yields have been trending up very well. Also replicated side by side trials almost always show a good return on cereals, not as consistent on canola but big gains some years. Soy does not get a fungicide. Reply With Quote