Some insight into problems with market economy

[cottonpicken]

5 simple words could have answered my question.

BECAUSE THERE ARE MORE DOLLARS

But you couldnt answer the simplest of questions.

But you feel the need to give your opinion.

And come election day you'll vote for who ever promises you the most.

And the downward cycle will continue.

And when we hit bottom you'll be looking for a scape goat,even though the real criminal stares back at you in every mirror you look into.

Maybe your younger,smarter,better looking.

But i doubt it.

[vagabonddreamer]

cotton...i didnt realize you would have to google the answer to the question you posed...i figured you would have it right off the top...

a bigger question is WHAT does gold have to do with the original post or this thread?? it was a theoretical discussion on freemarket/captitalism/government intervention into market forces...the ONLY parallel that can be drawn is that the respective FEDERAL reserves at the time of the last great depression decided to go off the gold standard to stimulate the economy...dont think ANYBODY could guess as to what the world would look like today if that had not been done...

and then...free market forces were allowed to run rampant and look where we are...the fed in iceland was at 900% of GDP...the US is at 400% of GDP...these "repsonsible" financial institutions were allowed to run amok with little or no government regulation or intervention...and here you are...YOU cotton...you and your consumerist friends purchasing lamborghinis on credit were the cause of all this...and your banker friends had no one to answer to...so they just kept demanding the government keep printing money...and the government in laissez-faire fashion decreed that the free market would dictate the direction of fiscal policy...

the more important part of this though...is that indeed i AM better looking and younger...but...if you adopt me and take me in as your long lost son...i will teach you how to dress and relate to your fellow human beings...and you can fill the void space in my head with all your worldly knowledge and teachings...vs

[vagabonddreamer]

cotton...tell me you look exactly like Yosemite Sam from bugs bunny...i just have this picture of you with six guns blazing...taking the gold rocks from the rabbit...

but seriously...i voted conservative with my fingers pinching my nose (Stockwell Day who believes that fossils were put on earth by the devil to play tricks with creationism and that dinosaurs and man co-existed)...because they promised fiscal responsibility and to repeal the biggest boondogle ever..the gun registry...apparently...

i think...YOU should form a political party...i can tell you that i would vote for you in a second!!! vs

[cottonpicken]

What does gold have to do with this?

Thats the point!

The Gold standard would prevent all this!!!!!!!!!!


Argueing about a subject with somebody that doesnt have the first clue about the subject is a waste of time.

[cottonpicken]

http://www.mises.org/

Educate yourself.This is what capitalism is.Not our distorted sick system.

[dmlfarmer]

There is one country in the world which is the perfect case study for this discussion: Chile. It went from as close to pure socialism under Allende as possible to textbook Milton Friedman free market economics.

I wish everyone contributing to this discussion could have the opportunity to talk to Chilean farmers who lost all their land under Allende, built back up thier opperations under Pinocet, only to lose their farms again because large mining companies have bought the all the rights to the water in the rivers that these farmers depend upon for irrigation. Not happening you say? This is from this morning's New York Times: Chilean Town Withers in Free Market for Water
By ALEXEI BARRIONUEVO
In Quillagua, water rights are private property and can
be traded with little government oversight.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/15/world/americas/15chile.html?th&emc=th

Pure free market economics is no more sustainable than pure socialism.

[tower]

I had a look at that cotton, and was glad to see that it also pointed out that communism was not the sick perverted thing that it became. It could have gone on to say that Christianity could have held up better as well.

That is the point though, you just know that the fewer the restraints on any lifestyle system the more corruption there will be. Smith and other well known advocates of the various religions suggested that personal restraints could be adequate. The trouble is that those who exhibit such personal restraint turn into victims for those who don't.

[vagabonddreamer]

i very much have learned from this discussion...most of the people who have contributed have a genuine interest and have laid out their arguments in a defined manner...i dont disagree nor do i have a lack of knowledge with respect to the gold standard and the possible benefits and disadvantages...

i just get my back up at how the message is being delivered...and it seems as though if there is a perception that an "opinion" (which apparently we are not allowed to put forth cotton unless it falls inline with your own doctrines)...extremism, closed mindedness, and punishment through name calling and bullying are archaic table scraps of a bygone era...

as i have said before in other threads...for all your personality flaws...you are a pretty smart guy...just like francisco and classylib...and i dont necessarily disagree with most of the ideas you have put forth...but as soon as i get a scent of extremism or closed minded chest thumping...that old devils advocate thing comes out in me...lol

you gotta know...most intellectual breakthroughs in the history of mankind have come because of opposing viewpoints and the desire through debate to prove ones thesis...you should WELCOME opposing viewpoints as they will either make your own arguments stronger...or they might even change the way you think (???????????????????????NAH)

though you KNOW more than anyone here...you are still learning from the mistakes that the REST of us make in our discussions...

my apologies to the forum for poking cotton and francisco with a metaphorical stick to get them going...but it was not without provocation...

keyenesian economics has nothing DIRECTLY to do with whether a country is on a gold standard (or salt for that matter)...that is a fiscal policy that is mutually exclusive of the operation of government and economic modeling...it is merely a benchmark...good or bad depending on your particular philosophy...however...i wonder how a global economy would function if say just ONE country was on a gold standard and the rest werent???

dmlfarmer...unfortunately my knowledge on chilean politics is limited...i remember when Pinnocet took power...i guess the problem i would have using chile as a measurement is that on an economies of scale..they are very small...small enough that they may be able to operate as an island unto themselves...and i suppose there is a question as to whether they have a true democracy in the sense that we THINK we have a true democracy in North America/europe...how do you reckon their political model would work expanded to a country the size of the US??? vs

[cottonpicken]

I reserve the right to debate as forcefully as i see fit.Same with everyone.

You didn't jab anybody vaga,you were the one that got jabbed.

Instead of bringing up a minor south american economy,with more variables than i can think of,look at the first two years of the US.

[dmlfarmer]

While you may consider Chile to be a "minor" SA country it has the highest GDP per capita of any South American Country. It has more bilateral and free trade agreements(57) than any other country in the world. It has over 16 million people living in small country, a good portion of which is ranked the driest place on earth and less than 3% of the country is arable, yet it is an net exporter of agricultural products, and ranked 5 in the world in wine exports. It has more than double the irrigation acres that all of Canada has. It has a positive balance of trade based on commodities exported. (Chile's copper is Alberta's oil!)

It has been and is ranked number one in South America by UN and media rankings in just about every indice regarding democracy, freedoms, and economy. The exceptions being enviornmental sustainability and quality of life, both which reflects the bottom line, profit at any cost culture of big business.

It is considered the most stable and democratic country in South America.

So instead of claiming this country is too small to consider, I challenge you to take a look at a country that has actually experienced Socialism, Marxism and Capitalism over the last 40 years. It may show you what may happen in many other countries in the world if the global economy continues to worsen.

This is why I suggested on this list of looking at this real present day country. Based on what I know, seen and expericed in Chile, I again state both pure socialism and capilalism are unsustainable. Under man evolves to the point where he understands with every right there comes responsibility there has been and always will be a need of regulation