Land Rent

[Ron]

Lakenheath, tooghgoofit
Here it goes, I have been farming 12 years, I have never had canola less than #2 (one year), my 5 year canola average is 45 bu/ac (including the drought and hail), 55 bushel red spring wheat here is a shitty crop, average is closer to 70, excellant is 90 (it is hard to get protein premiums with these yields though).
My reserve fund is I am a grain farmer, instead of curling all winter I go work in the patch if I have to. A good month I can make $10,000.
The cost of living on an extra quarter is $0.00, that is why it is an extra quarter, depreciation is the same per year, 600 acres or 1000 acres. You can buy a decent JD 7700, MF 860 etc for 10-20000. Who cares about depreciation on these things, repairs are cheap if you can work on your own equipment.
In central alberta we have very steady yield history, low freight rates, and oilfield options for work. I am sorry that in cigarette butt Saskatchewan you dont. Here we make $60 rent pay. I said before I dont like it, I would prefer $40/ac but I pay what the market demands.
Toughgoofit, sorry about the math error it was a quick post.
Dont assume your crappy freight rates, uncertain weather etc is everywhere. Here our problems are urban sprawl and whining acreage owners. Very high competition for land, If you dont want to pay $60/ac it is easy. DONT. Get a job and move to town because you wont have land to farm.

[Ron]

Cowman, what I meant about mineral rights is that your cousin is pulling big money from his oil rights. He is probably paying such a ridiculous amount because there is money in the oil side of it, and he's waiting for you to die then he can buy your land. Grainfarming itself will not work at 60-100/acre.

Lakenheath I was totally on board with everything you said except that crop share is the only way to go. I don't know what you pay for crop share, but I rent all my land cash rent. $32/acre.
Most guys here go 25% crop share 45bus/acre wheat*25% is 11.25bu/acre*3.50=40/acre cropshare in rent how is this better than cash rent.

[Ron]

Ron we all know that Alberta is the king of oil, the king of farming, the king of beef. I have cousins in Fort Mcleod, and pay your cheap rent at 60/acre have 500 head of beef pay your cheap freight have your excellent weather and just went into recievership.(sorry cous)

[bigred]

Ron,
You have made the best argument to prove that farming doesn't pay. You can earn $10000/month off farm to pay the expenses of the farm, what other business owner takes on an "off bussiness" job to pay the expenses. It just goes to show that you can't make it by farming alone. And on the note that an old combine has no depreciation, again what the heck are you saying, you have to make enough to replace it even if it is only $20000, that's still depreciation.
You would make better money to rent your land for the 40 or 60 an acre and work in the patch year round, you'd come out ahead.

[Ron]

Big Red, I started to answer your post but screw it.
You guys dont get the point. You pay what the market wants or you dont. It is your choice, rent the land or dont.

I think this is a dead issue and wont respond further

[Ron]

Ron, yeah we get the point Albertans can do nothing but make money with farming. All the power to you guys. I don't see why so many Albertans are bitching on this website about farming then.

[cowman]

Vader: You bring up a very good point about over production and I agree that is THE big problem. In this area, with the great weather, demand for feed grain is poor this year and is a real problem.
toughoofit: Not sure if $32 is enough for the land owner? Don't know what land prices are in your area? I do believe with a crop share you are spreading out your risk?
I know there is some very good land in Saskatchewan...the area around Lumsden comes to mind? A fairly close neighbor recently sold out and bought land (5000 acres) around Regina at a very decent price compared to here? I kind of wondered why he would do that but he felt he needed to double his land base if his kids were going to farm and it was impossible to do here. There are a lot of farmers/ranchers moving to Saskatchewan from Alberta.

[sawfly]

lets face it . we need some well heeled farmers around,from oil .old money or just blessed crop areas.
who else is gonna buy 300,000$ combines,tractors ,sprayers etc.
enableing the rest of us to pick them up years latter for 100,000$.
who else can come into our area and buy land to hold up land values,for us to retire on.
the rents have already fallen here from 28-40 down to 17-30 . some may rent at 15 this spring.
people arnt jumping at these rates.without being able to lock in any profitable prices.
why invest 100,000$ in rent and inputs,when an optimistic return looks like 110-125 thous. more realistic return is break even,and better than 50-50 chance,from poor prices,frost drought etc. your into losses,possibly huge.
you can take that kind of hit,if the bank account is flush,and the oil money flows,but for the rest of us its economic life or death.

[sawfly]

Cowman, I will be very interested to see how your neighbor makes out by Regina. I don't wish him bad but if the yields are as good as Ron says in Central Alberta your neighbor is going to get a bad suprise here because frost,drought, grasshoppers etc, are realistic problems.

Sawfly I agree with you, if it wasn't for these elite rich guys mabye the rest of us would die.

Vader I agree to some extent that we are over producing, but wheat stocks are going to be there lowest since 1981 in the world. I bet though the CWB new crop pros will not reflect this shortage. My bet new crop wheat stay the same as this year or slightly higher, but not in reality to what Kansas, and Minneapolis are trading at.

[lakenheath]

Ron, did you forget to metion you farm irragated land? If not you are full of shit.

I have lots of Ron's for neighbours in that sense also. Usually have to shave off 20%-25% of what they claim they yield. Or maybe they think their fields are a bit smaller than they really are and that dockage doesn't count against yield or that maybe their yield monitor is not calibrated.